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Message:: [QUOTE="GDJMSP, post: 3442417, member: 112"]By some yes, by others no. For example, it was in 1960 that I first started collecting coins. And once I did my grandfather sat me down and explained something to me while looking at coins in his collection. What he did was to show me examples of coins that had been harshly/improperly cleaned and examples of coins that had not. And he asked me if I could see the difference. On some I could easily see the difference, on others I could not see it at all. But he explained what to look for and how to recognize it. But the primary point that he was trying to get across to me was this, for most collectors harshly cleaning your coins was not only OK but expected. They believed that's what you were supposed to do with your coins. Every once in a while you were to get them out and wipe them down with a rag or cloth. And this had been the acceptable practice for hundreds of years. And it wasn't just collectors, even museums did this, it was even done at the Smithsonian with the official US Collection. However, he was in a different group. He was of the belief that doing that harmed the coins, and he showed how and why it harmed the coins. I was only 7 years old at the time but even then I could easily see what he was saying, and I agreed with it. Collectors who thought like he did were the definite minority, but there were others like him. And over time their numbers grew. I cannot tell you exactly when it changed, but my guess would be that it was in the 1970s that things changed and the minority became the majority. And since then it has continued that way with the numbers of collectors against harsh cleaning growing and the numbers in favor of it shrinking. But even today there are still those who think nothing of it and they still practice harsh cleaning. Sometimes it's due to ignorance, sometimes it's due to they just don't like the way the coin looks so they do whatever they can to try and make it "look" better. Better in their eyes anyway, and they don't much care how they get it that way. So by the time the TPGs arrived, and their beginnings were in the 1970s, harsh cleaning was largely frowned on. By '86 and '87 when PCGS and NGC came along harsh cleaning was pretty much looked upon as being a sin if you will. But even then there were still those who disagreed. And as I said some of them still exist. It is said that the practice of harsh cleaning began in Europe before the US even existed. Back then it was largely royalty and nobility that collected coins. And they had someone whose job it was to take care of their collections, and that included getting the coins out every now and then and wiping them down with cloths and rags. It was simply what was done, what was supposed to be done. And that's largely why it's so hard to find examples of old European coins that have not been harshly cleaned. But since you can find them, rather obviously not everybody did their jobs. And it was while I was helping to write "Gold Ducats Of The Netherlands" that I found additional information that I had read about long before - that dipping coins was also in practice at least a couple hundred years ago. I can't say it was really common, but it did happen. At some point some industrious caretaker had discovered that using chemicals and or cleaning agents of one kind or another worked, and worked quite well when caring for the coins of their master. And it was easier. So as I see it, that perhaps explains why some old European coins can be found that do not have traces of harsh cleaning. Bottom line, the practice of cleaning coins, both harshly and properly, is very, very old. And as with most things over time we have learned better and better ways of doing it, and doing it without harming the coins. But even today there are still only a few methods by which this can be done. And even today there are still those who do not practice those methods.[/QUOTE]

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