Question about Scratches/Rim damaged coins

Love The Rant!!

I generally agree with your statements of grading convolution, concerning "top tier" TPG, but especially of one. I have appreciable documentation to support/substantiate your opinion, but just one example, as shown in this thread, would suffice.

I generally always appreciated the grading standards of ANACS, ACG, SEGS, PCI, etc. who would grade coins, but clarify problematic exceptions to the norm (e.g. scratched, cleaned, etc.). They provided what I considered a "plus" grade service.

I know/knew individuals who would remove "damaged" coins from their holders, often "clean/dip" to attenuate, and submit to another TPG who would accept the deficiencies without clarification, often to attain a higher grade.

I have an appreciable collection of 4 figure coins that an independent objective certifier could add to their list of coins with a qualifier of "what were they thinking?", which I've posted here occasionally in the past to show various grading disparities.

Rich :thumb:

 

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It seems to me that all the stability TPG's were to bring to collecting, is slowly deteriorating.

 

+1

 

I have a lot of experience with antique folding knives - they don't get "slabbed", but highest value is usually associated with some combination of rarity and condition - cleaning is generally a negative. So, it's similar to coins - there are professionals who will evaluate and state their professional opinions about a piece for a fee - but generally the buyer has to learn the characteristics of the knives, how they wear and how the condition of one piece is relative to the pool that's available for a specific piece - why isn't that good enough for coins? I just don't see the value of professional grading for circulated coins - authentication, sure - but grading seems to me to be in the eye of the beholder since every coin is a little different - especially circulated coins. The grading/slabbing thing for lower priced coins (i dunno, under $300?) still seems like a racket to me.

 

I feel that this non gradable crap is exactly that they should grade it and put the damage details and leave it to buyers to judge what they will pay.

Honestly, there are different buyers out there, problem free and ones that don’t care if it’s damaged based on the historical significance they can pay a lot.

Bunch of money making edited so you can take it out of the slab and hope a more reputable grading company can give the coin a chance.

 

Funny to read my own posts from 8 years ago. I still like raw coins in the lower value ranges, but in pricier/rarer more valuable pieces I like the confirmation from the TPG’s - even if I have to take them with the proverbial grain of salt - and they don’t make knowledge irrelevant - that’s for sure.

I like pieces in my collection to be full grade, not details - but if something is available with a bag mark or dig in a relatively insignificant location on the coin - and as a result I can get a rare coin for a lot less $ - then i’m Glad the TPG was open to grading it as opposed to giving it a details grade. So....

 

I disagree. A scratch on the die which is what we are looking at in both the images above, is not post mint and therefore the die state should be taken into account. PCGS is overly consistent to a fault, they dont even give out there methodology or qualifications for decisions when asked. To me there needs to be an app for the every day collector that can cross reference images of your own coins again st documented states to verify what is and is not on the die at at point.

 

I do not see how you think it's a scratch on the die. Both pics show coins with incuse marks. For this to be on the die, it would have to raised. Are you proposing a scratched master die? If so, hundreds of thousands of identical marks would exist on similar dated coins.

 

Yes, I apologize for the misunderstanding. The early die stage coins would show as such. As the dies pound out coins, these Mark's steadily diminish until disappearing into the field. I have progressions from the 1965 washington quarter and the wounded eagle dollar that support my working theory as well as a wide rim SBA that has a set of deep adjustment mark looking scratches across 3 axis and show in early die stages but are gone in e next earliest ive been able to examine. I have yet to be disproven, though I welcome any info that proves me wrong and justifies walking away from TPGs completely. I'm not a professional either to be clear. I have a large inherited collection and my own 35 years of collecting and am educated in physics, chemistry, and metallurgy to a reasonable professional level. Thanks for the reply.