Proof or Business Strike?

They're definitely not proofs, and they're just middling uncirculated. That's MU-62.

 

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MU62 ya say? I'll take it

 

And now we offer at auction, the very first ever, super special 1964 Set taken from millions of others and specifically graded of their own variety...now recognized as Middle Uncirculated. Population Report of precisely 1 of each...wait 32 Halves, 12 quarters, 17 dimes... Expected Value of $275,000! Get em while they're hot

 

In all seriousness though, what's that mean when you say it? To me, it the exact description of the SMS coins. Minus their markers that they bring up on whichever auction at the time. To me, the striations in the fields lead me to believe they were struck on refinished dies. Other years of silver coins known to be struck from refinished dies and striations like those found on coins like the few over date Buffalo Nickels are where I drew that conclusion and yet again I could be wrong but it has been pointed out in the description of the SMS Coins for 1964 that they were undoubtedly struck from refinished dies. The only reason it seems impossible to ever know is because to some, it looks like a proof, to others average uncirculated. Then the few who see what I see and can agree they are somewhere in between. If they had no luster or their wider than average cartwheel, I'd think maybe they were polished straight from the mint set and then toned, but they aren't fully mirrored. Only the devices. So perfectly that there is clear contrast but maybe somebody was just that good at polishing tiny details. Crazy...

 

YES, definitely. Let's see if we can run this thread up to forty pages.

 

The cent could be the only coin in the bunch that might grade high...but the pic. is fuzzy so I can,t tell!

 

That's a provable falsehood. Exactly matching reverse die cracks could be used to prove the *possibility" of a particular DDO, but could never prove it's existence without examining the obverse. A given reverse die can be paired with multiple obverse dies (and vice versa).

If you need an example to be convinced that you cannot reliably determine a shield nickel obverse variety from the reverse alone:



This reverse is paired with both an 1883/2 variety and a non-variety 1883.






Perhaps you meant the "provable fact" is that you had the pleasure of examining two file cabinets. I would not dispute that.

 

Verifying both faces of any variety is a fundamental aspect of attribution, and an absolute requirement for many earlier issues.

Is there any authoritative reference, anywhere, which unequivocally proves that 1964 SMS sets were deliberately produced? The only thing I can glean from PCGS is "because we said so."

 

It's well struck and shows full steps with no inte

You said it Dave! I came across what looks to be the 1964 Quarter they picture in the CoinFacts App, Same exact Polish Lines, Great Strike, Semi Proof Like. The quarter they use almost reminds me of brushed aluminum. Anyways, New Holder, Ms65...$49. I would bet money it was the same exact coin and I do believe it's MS67 on the Photos from the Phone App. Someone got greedy and got a huge slap in the face. I'll try to find pictures I have screenshots of stored in my phone but no BS, if it wasn't the same coin, it was exactly the same. But that goes on to say that if they're the same, it would have to be a select few that turned out that way. So that would only lead to to questions from another recent post of mine questioning"Top Two" TPG Manipulation based on who you are and what you pay

 

First off, nice photos. You forgot to post the reverse of one coin to support your contention. I should like to see it rather than take your word that they are the same die.

You post one of very many cases where two different reverses (?) were used with the same obverse. Got me!

The point of your nitpicking has demonstrated you are an advanced collector and I'll THANK YOU now for correcting my GENERALIZATION used to refute another false post that indicated you cannot verify a variety by one side WHICH IS COMMONLY DONE EVERYDAY by many advanced collectors/dealers who usually make a "game" out of it just to keep sharp.

Let's see the other reverse when you get the chance.

 

Have you compared these coins with those shown on the VDB coins web site? The edge detail is very sharp on SP coins, as well as other points you described... If you even consider them to be SP strikes, have the set graded for your peace of mind. ANACS has a Fall special for $10 per coin for 15 coins, and $7 extra for varieties. If your,s were genuine SPs, the fee would go up but who cares?

 

Ya I have been led to VDB numerous times when searching for anything other than PCGS Ava Adams stories. They're nice coins, I just don't think they're all that rare considering 1964's having to be struck into the fall of 1965, after the 1965 SMS were in production as of May that same year. So the "Refinished Dies" they use to describe the SP 64's could have easily been those dies because of shorter runs for Proof/SMS Dies, right? Just a theory of mine but I just don't think they're as rare as they're said to be. Now I assume since, because of the already high mintage, nobody felt a need to collect BU 1964's by the end of 1965 so they just went into circulation and left random examples of such coins. Just my thoughts on where they're actually from.

 

Now if I send them in to ANACS, what's the best route to take? Do the fall special, pay for attribution, and ask them to notify me before slabbing them? I think if any TPG will honestly be able to attribute a rare variety, they would be best anyways. I've just never seen a 1964 SMS in an ANACS holder.

 

Just an inexpensive way to find out...then do a crossover if they,re genuine.

 

But ANACS will recognize the variety IF they are? I know it's a huge if but its worth finding out

 

Call them for advice and pricing...they,re very helpful.

 

From the close up images I've seen of a couple the 64 SMS coins, the dies were heavily and coarsely polished and not finished with the polishing lap.

No official documentation that I know of.

 

@howards Any luck with that other photo of the reverse?

 

Nice Nickel