Pre 1933 Gold question

Looking to start putting some money into pre 1933 gold.

I have some questions.

1. Are ungraded coins from an online company worth it? Do they follow bullion prices only or is there any collector value for ungraded?

2. If I pay extra for graded what is the minimum grade to make it worth the extra?

3. Any size? Are fractional worth it?

Thank you for any extra insight or advice.

 

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1. If from a reputable site (Such as Apmex or Provident Metals, etc) then yes they are. Some follow bullion prices such as cleaned, holed or bent ones and other common date problem free coins do hold a premium over melt. You can compare melt prices from coinflation to ended ebay auctions for common year gold coins to get a good idea on such premiums.

2. This is a pretty subjective question. For a common date gold coin, don't pay a premium for XF just because it is graded. When you get to the MS+, then you might start to se numismatic value driving the price beyond its normal premium.

3. Any size is fine. It really comes down to personal preference. The smaller the coin ($1, $2.50) the higher the difference you will see from bullion value to premium value. If you mostly after the gold content and just want the history, I would try to get a $10 or $20 if it is within your budget.

Hope that helps and if you have anymore questions, ask away!

 

What does "cleaned" mean and is it worth adding to a collection or just getting for melt value?

 

Cleaned usually means harshly cleaned , meaning there are hairlines or noticeable loss of luster or color from over dipping , or many other problems . Whether you should add a cleaned coin to your collection is up to you . I'd wait until you've learned more and can make an objective decision on what you want and like as there is much to learn about the pricing of so called "problem coins". If you can afford uncleaned coins I'd go with them for a collection , but if you just want bullion I'd go with whatever is cheaper . Good luck in your collecting .

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/cleaned

Seriously though, there are many different ways of cleaning a coin - some acceptable and some not - but in this case we're talking about unacceptable harsh and damaging cleaning. As for it being worth adding such a coin to a collection, this depends on the collector and, of course, the coin, but generally speaking, they're probably best to avoid as collectibles, at least with the generic coins you seem to be asking about.

 

I wouldn't mind having a scratched or slightly damaged coin in my collection, if it's a really old or rare coin. But I do not want any cleaned coins because that means someone altered/damaged the coin's surfaces, either knowing or not knowing what they did.

 

I have an NGC Registry gold type set (the short one; no designs issued before 1834).
It's complete.
Of course that means they are all slabbed.
Here it is.
If you are not familiar with this chart click on the "eye" to see the coin:

http://coins.www.collectors-society.com/registry/coins/MySets_Listing.aspx?PeopleSetID=57246

 

1. Are ungraded coins from an online company worth it? Do they follow bullion prices only or is there any collector value for ungraded?

Yes and no. You will probably pay more for a graded coin, but it should be easier to sell in the future should you decide to do so. Because the coin is graded, you should be able to recover the premium you paid.

2. If I pay extra for graded what is the minimum grade to make it worth the extra?

It sounds like you are just starting out, no? Personally, I purchased ungraded gold Indians and half eagles from reputable dealers when I started out. It’s exciting to hold a coin that is 100 years old in its raw form rather than one encased in plastic. You can find 2.50 Indian fractionals for ~$260 and $5 Indian/eagles for ~350-430 on up. When you learn more about the business, start shopping for graded double Eagles/Saint Gaudens.

3. Any size? Are fractional worth it?

Yup.

 

I've wrestled with this question myself and even asked a week or so ago. The first thing you need to ask yourself is why are you looking at Pre33 gold? As an investment or do you just really like these coins?

I wanted to buy some because I've always wanted them but I needed to convince myself it was "worth" it for more than the satisfaction. Let's face it, these coins aren't cheap.

I opted to look for slab coins so I could be somewhat confident they were real and not cleaned or damaged. I've seen cleaned slab coins and frankly I can't see it so buying raw is a crapshoot to me as far as resale.

I spent a few hours and threw together a spreadsheet to try to answer my own questions. My numbers came from the PCGS Coin Facts website.

I picked common date $5 Indian, $10 Indian and $20 St Gauden. I didn't do liberty but may someday because they seem to carry a lower premium over spot but I really really love the Indians.

I next researched back 10yrs of price history of AU55 vs MS63 grades. I noted each year on Jan 01 what the value was all the way to current year. I did the same with the gold spot price, stock market index and also a mutual fund price.

I then compared what a $5000 investment in each type would be for each year.

For investment I found my mutual fund #1, stock index #2, gold bullion #3, AU55 #4 and MS63 #5.

I found that the high premium paid for MS63 over spot wasn't worth it "to me" from an investment standpoint. But I found that the balance between premium over spot, yet satisfaction of owning a still beautiful AU55 was worth it. So my quest for AU50-58 slabbed coins began of which I've acquired 2 that I am very happy with. Still searching for others as AU55+/- gold isn't slabbed often which surprises me based upon the cost of these coins. What's $25-40 to insure a problem free coin when you are looking at $500-$1500 coins.

I totally ruled out $2.50 and smaller gold because the premium on even AU55 coins is nearly double the gold value. Unless I decide to do a gold type set or acquire a C or D mint maybe for fun.

This is my hybrid way to collect and invest(justify a want) in gold coins.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

 

Just received my first classic US gold coin today, let me know what y'all think

 

NGC has better pics, just look up cert ID 3692274-008...

 

Very nice! Mind me asking how much that set you back?

 

I have paid $355 +shipping +custom dues if that was your question. It looks just perfect in hand not sure why it didn't get a higher grade.

 

You got a steal of a deal! Did you get it off ebay?

 

Yes I did. eBay is not always bad

 

Wow!! Nice snag for sure.

 

Not at all, I've gotten some really good deals on ebay, including gold coins. All the gold bugs must have been sleeping that day, normally graded gold coins get fairly high bids. Guess it was your lucky day.

 

Did you happen to post the wrong cert#? Because that cert comes back on a 1909D and yours looks like a 1925?

 

OK ya got me... try this number instead: 3579453-005 ;-)