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Message:: [QUOTE="Insider, post: 2331835, member: 24314"]I appreciate the threads you both have given to me.  In all honesty, This is old news.  The "S" mintmark positions have been published since the 1980's.  In the threads, the people show Chinese "chocolate" junk that any informed YN can tell are fake and compare that crap to a genuine coin (one of which had a slightly deformed "N").  In my experience this is an anomaly. I am embarrassed to say I jumped the gun on the OP because the "S" was the wrong shape.  In my rush, I missed all the clear evidence that the entire coin was a C/F!  Thankfully, Rims corrected me quickly so hopefully no one was mislead.   Now, back to my original question.  IMO, the shape of the "N" is not any way to determine if a 1909-S VDB cent is genuine.  Never heard of that, never was taught that, and have never observed that - ever.  I shall dig out a few 1909-S, 1909 VDB, and 1909-S VDB cents and post photos of the "N's"  I repeat that I have never seen a difference and don't believe there is a difference as the "N" is part of the hub that made all the dies used at each Mint. Anyway, I'll let you all decide.  If I am wrong about this, I will be the first to point that out.[/QUOTE]