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Phillip III 8 Reales Cob from Potosi
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<p>[QUOTE="robinjojo, post: 24481076, member: 110226"]The value of a cob is determined very much in the way and ancient coin is valued. As hammer struck coins each coin is unique. Unlike machine struck coins no two cobs are exactly identical. </p><p><br /></p><p>Here are some factors, based on my experience:</p><p><br /></p><p>1. Type. Some cobs are very special. They are special because of their designs, which do not conform with the vast majority. Usually these are cobs produced for a limited period or limited quantities. Three cases come to mind. First there's the three reales cobs of Charles I, the Carlos and Johanna type, without waves. These are extremely rare. I do not have an example and doubt if I could ever afford one. Second, there is the very rare "Star of Lima" cobs of 1659-1660. These were experimental coins in all likelihood. Lima was in a dormant period, without producing any cob coinage that I know of since the late 1500's. Numismatists speculate that the Star of Lima coinage was intended to demonstrate to the Spanish Crown the ability of the mint to produce coinage in the relatively new pillars and waves format, a format used by the other mints except for Mexico, which kept the the old shield and cross design. I do have a Star of Lima cob, which is illustrated in Sedwick's <i>Practical Book of Cobs </i>(more on that later).</p><p><br /></p><p>Lima, 8 reales, Philip IV, 1659, Assayer V, "Star of Lima". </p><p>KM 18.1 </p><p>27.6 grams</p><p><br /></p><p>[ATTACH=full]1548870[/ATTACH] </p><p><br /></p><p>Third, the mints of Potosi, Lima and Mexico produced limited quantities of what I think were presentation coins, the so-called "royal" cobs. These were coins struck on nearly perfectly round flans, often with specially prepared dies. An even rarer type, a sub type, is the heart shaped cobs. All are quite rare, the latter extremely rarer, and are often holed. I have one late round cob, from 1746, Potosi, purchased from Freeman Craig back in the early 1980s.</p><p><br /></p><p><b>Potosi, 8 reales, Philip V, 1746, assayer q, round type.</b></p><p><b>KM R31.a</b></p><p><b>26.3 grams</b></p><p><b><br /></b></p><p><b>[ATTACH=full]1548871[/ATTACH] </b></p><p><b><br /></b></p><p>2. Strike and surfaces. In my book an un-salvaged coin is generally preferable to a corroded one. Of course the degree of corrosion is a factor, with some cobs coming out of the sea corroded to the point of being thin wafers with little or no detail. Another factor is strike, which is extremely variable. It's important to keep in mind that these coins were little more than silver or gold ingots, struck to prescribed standards (at least theoretically), and stamped with dies indicating a sanctioning by the crown. If only a small part of the cross or shield were imprinted, so be it. Speed of production, usually in primitive conditions, was the priority. The Spanish Crown needed the flow of these coin to be constant, through the pipeline of galleons, to finance the costs of war and to pay the bankers of Genoa, Milan and others for loans provided to the crown. So sloppy strikes are more the rule than exception. Cobs that are well centered, bold and with nice surfaces command premiums across the board. The Potosi 8 reales cob, assayer B, shown below, is a fairly common coin, but this example is in very good condition, with a good strike and nice surfaces. This is a coin obtained from Hal Blackburn, for those who knew him.</p><p><br /></p><p><b>Potosi, 8 reales cob, Philip II, No Date (circa 1581-1586), Assayer B.</b></p><p><b>Paloetti Group 5B No 83.</b></p><p><b><br /></b></p><p><b>[ATTACH=full]1548881[/ATTACH] </b></p><p><b><br /></b></p><p>3. Period. Some periods, such as the late 1500s, produced many really appealing coins, in terms of quality, as shown above. However this is not true throughout the history of the production of these coins. There are periods that produce horrendous coins, at least in terms of quality, such as the coinage of Charles II at the Mexico City mint, and there was even a period at Potosi when fraud was committed by some assayers to debase coins for profit. These variations in quality may turn off collectors who seek perfection and beauty, but there are many, including myself, who sees these crude creations as objects of desire.</p><p><br /></p><p>Here's a crude cob, dated 1646, produced at Potosi in the middle of the debasement scandal, a scandal that ultimately resulted in the execution of an assayer in 1650.</p><p><br /></p><p>The date runs on the cross side from about 10 to a little past 11 o'clock.</p><p><br /></p><p><b>Potosi, 8 reales, Philip IV 1646, assayer R over P. Extremely rare.</b></p><p><b>KM 19a </b></p><p><b>26.2 grams</b></p><p><b><br /></b></p><p><b>[ATTACH=full]1548882[/ATTACH] </b></p><p><b><br /></b></p><p>So there's no really simple answer to the question of value. KM does have values, but they are outdated. The best I can suggest is to study auction results and the prices on dealers' lists. And the important point of all is to have fun and acquire knowledge on these historical coins.</p><p><br /></p><p>You might consider getting a copy of the <i>Practical Book of Cobs</i>. It is a handy, excellent reference for all collectors, beginners and old timers. Make sure that you get the most current edition (fourth edition).[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="robinjojo, post: 24481076, member: 110226"]The value of a cob is determined very much in the way and ancient coin is valued. As hammer struck coins each coin is unique. Unlike machine struck coins no two cobs are exactly identical. Here are some factors, based on my experience: 1. Type. Some cobs are very special. They are special because of their designs, which do not conform with the vast majority. Usually these are cobs produced for a limited period or limited quantities. Three cases come to mind. First there's the three reales cobs of Charles I, the Carlos and Johanna type, without waves. These are extremely rare. I do not have an example and doubt if I could ever afford one. Second, there is the very rare "Star of Lima" cobs of 1659-1660. These were experimental coins in all likelihood. Lima was in a dormant period, without producing any cob coinage that I know of since the late 1500's. Numismatists speculate that the Star of Lima coinage was intended to demonstrate to the Spanish Crown the ability of the mint to produce coinage in the relatively new pillars and waves format, a format used by the other mints except for Mexico, which kept the the old shield and cross design. I do have a Star of Lima cob, which is illustrated in Sedwick's [I]Practical Book of Cobs [/I](more on that later). Lima, 8 reales, Philip IV, 1659, Assayer V, "Star of Lima". KM 18.1 27.6 grams [ATTACH=full]1548870[/ATTACH] Third, the mints of Potosi, Lima and Mexico produced limited quantities of what I think were presentation coins, the so-called "royal" cobs. These were coins struck on nearly perfectly round flans, often with specially prepared dies. An even rarer type, a sub type, is the heart shaped cobs. All are quite rare, the latter extremely rarer, and are often holed. I have one late round cob, from 1746, Potosi, purchased from Freeman Craig back in the early 1980s. [B]Potosi, 8 reales, Philip V, 1746, assayer q, round type. KM R31.a 26.3 grams [ATTACH=full]1548871[/ATTACH] [/B] 2. Strike and surfaces. In my book an un-salvaged coin is generally preferable to a corroded one. Of course the degree of corrosion is a factor, with some cobs coming out of the sea corroded to the point of being thin wafers with little or no detail. Another factor is strike, which is extremely variable. It's important to keep in mind that these coins were little more than silver or gold ingots, struck to prescribed standards (at least theoretically), and stamped with dies indicating a sanctioning by the crown. If only a small part of the cross or shield were imprinted, so be it. Speed of production, usually in primitive conditions, was the priority. The Spanish Crown needed the flow of these coin to be constant, through the pipeline of galleons, to finance the costs of war and to pay the bankers of Genoa, Milan and others for loans provided to the crown. So sloppy strikes are more the rule than exception. Cobs that are well centered, bold and with nice surfaces command premiums across the board. The Potosi 8 reales cob, assayer B, shown below, is a fairly common coin, but this example is in very good condition, with a good strike and nice surfaces. This is a coin obtained from Hal Blackburn, for those who knew him. [B]Potosi, 8 reales cob, Philip II, No Date (circa 1581-1586), Assayer B. Paloetti Group 5B No 83.[/B] [B] [ATTACH=full]1548881[/ATTACH] [/B] 3. Period. Some periods, such as the late 1500s, produced many really appealing coins, in terms of quality, as shown above. However this is not true throughout the history of the production of these coins. There are periods that produce horrendous coins, at least in terms of quality, such as the coinage of Charles II at the Mexico City mint, and there was even a period at Potosi when fraud was committed by some assayers to debase coins for profit. These variations in quality may turn off collectors who seek perfection and beauty, but there are many, including myself, who sees these crude creations as objects of desire. Here's a crude cob, dated 1646, produced at Potosi in the middle of the debasement scandal, a scandal that ultimately resulted in the execution of an assayer in 1650. The date runs on the cross side from about 10 to a little past 11 o'clock. [B]Potosi, 8 reales, Philip IV 1646, assayer R over P. Extremely rare. KM 19a 26.2 grams [ATTACH=full]1548882[/ATTACH] [/B] So there's no really simple answer to the question of value. KM does have values, but they are outdated. The best I can suggest is to study auction results and the prices on dealers' lists. And the important point of all is to have fun and acquire knowledge on these historical coins. You might consider getting a copy of the [I]Practical Book of Cobs[/I]. It is a handy, excellent reference for all collectors, beginners and old timers. Make sure that you get the most current edition (fourth edition).[/QUOTE]
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Phillip III 8 Reales Cob from Potosi
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