Petition for US Mint to change their gold coin lineup

I'll bet you're right!

He also posted this BS on the NGC forums, and when he was asked how many supporters (signatures) he had, he skirted the issue and never answered.

Chris

 

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I'll bet there's not many since he has asked several times in this thread if he altered the proposal in different ways...if that would help. It seems to me that once you had some signatures, it would be hard to alter anything.

 

I have yet to see anyone sign this petition of yours so to state you have "many young people among our supporters" is a flat out lie. Next CoinTalk does not have a disliking for younger people. We have several members here who are 16 and younger and they get along just fine with everyone heck I'm 19 and I'd say I am well respected here by most people.
Move on you are saying this discourages young people from bneing more engaged and have a say in the hobby. This is not true because we do not have a say in this hobby nobody does unless the US Mint has a voting contest for a reverse design like they did recenty with the HOF Coins. Collectors will collect whatever they want. Some only collect lincoln cents others a little of everything. Nobody has a say in what they can and can't collect.
Lastly, You keep claiming that YOUR ideas is a good one. I hate to say it but it just is not a good idea. We have spent 9 pages now pointing out all of the flaws with your idea and at this point one would think you would realize that this is not a good idea. Nobody wants redesigns of old coins because it hurts the value of the actual classic coins and angers those who have those coins. Next nobody wants the mint to submit directly to PCGS and NGC because not everyone wants a slabbed coin among other reasons.

It is best to just drop your petition nobody will support it for a wide variety of reasons.

 

VCC,

I won't deny that I have been pretty hard on you, not only here but on the NGC forums as well. The problem is that you have been your own worst enemy. You have continually made inaccurate statements, and when asked a direct question, you have avoided giving a direct answer.

Why should anyone take you seriously?

Let's put it this way. If you were running for a political office, and you conducted your campaign like this, I certainly wouldn't vote for you.

Chris

 

I figure you already have lots of choices Volcano:

1. Get over your distrust of private bullion. That's your problem, not the US Mint's problem.
2. Buy Canadian 1/20th oz gold.
3. Save up and buy authentic old bullion of the type and design you like. (Since prestige seems important to you, just think of the extra prestige that comes with owning a piece of history!)
4. Save up and buy current 1/10, 1/4, 1/2, or 1 ounce coins. As noted many times already, the smaller of a fraction you buy, the more overhead/premium you're paying. If you're really doing this to enable more people with limited resources to "invest" in gold, you aren't really doing them any favors.
5. Buy silver. (AKA - The less prestigious precious metal)

You've come up with (largely trivial) excuses for just about every alternative that people have offered, from the purity of older gold not being up to your standards, to price fluctuating faster with gold than silver (not even going to go there), to gold being more prestigious to own than silver, to private bullion being untrustworthy, to we just don't like young people (I don't consider myself "old"), to not being satisfied to take what the Mint offers, etc. This leads me to believe you are a person who just isn't satisfied unless you are getting exactly what you want.

I'm sorry, but I don't believe it is the duty of the US Mint to ensure that they are catering to your every desire. Given the plethora of options available to anyone interested in buying gold, I don't see any reason to force the US Mint to change their product line.

You've also mentioned that we should support change. I do support change, when I believe it is warranted and the proposed change is well thought out. Change for the sake of change isn't necessarily a good idea.

It looks like you'll have to rely on these "other people's support", because you do not have mine.

 

I know I said I wasn't going to go there, but I meant in that post, because this is a whole nuther can of worms.

Regarding gold being more volatile than silver:

What you're saying is similar to saying an ounce of gold fluctuates by a larger dollar amount than an ounce of silver. While this is true, as a few others have noted, it is largely irrelevant. Unless of course you are limited to owning only one ounce of precious metal. When no such arbitrary limitation exists, then what you do is invest $X in either gold or silver. If volatility is what you seek, then silver has historically been much more volatile than gold.

 

I've been lurking on this site for quite a while and I happened to see this thread. I admire VCC for his efforts to take the initiative on what should or should not be on the US Mint's product line. I think that we should not come down hard on VCC for coming up with ideas for the US Mint and this hobby to chew on.

I think that his ideas about reissuing classic gold coins is a great idea and I would buy them myself. Like many other people who love classic gold coins, I bought the 2009 UHR gold coin which is very popular and was very well received. I think that despite the criticism that has been presented towards VCC on the classic coin design idea, the US Mint reissuing classic coin designs will be well received.

I think that the criticism expressed in this thread was not constructive at all and it looked like everyone wanted to tear VCC down. I think that the criticism should have been done much more constructively because we should appreciate people taking the initiative to have a greater voice on the US Mint's product line. But I also believe that VCC could have made his case better because he did not do the greatest job in making his argument which he even admitted.

VCC has my support when it comes to reissuing classic coin designs because irrespective of what members here say, they are well received by the coin collecting public; the 2009 UHR gold coin is a perfect example of that.

 

OK, we have one vote in favor of reissuing classic coin designs.

I don't want to see the US Mint reissue any of their past designs. One reason is that it is already possible to revisit history through the existing coins. I'm more of a moving forward kind of person, and if we're going to change designs away from the current American Eagle designs, I would much rather see a new design than a rehash of an old design.

How about this compromise: Instead of reverting the Gold and Silver American Eagles to classic designs, how about we recommend they do what they did with the highly popular 2009 UHR, and that is release the old designs in the form of commemorative coins.

 

I hope I don't get anyone coming down hard on me if I start a petition for that compromise

 

Or, striking special sets and commemoratives in higher relief?

 

Hey Peter? Welcome to the forum.........and the fracas.

 

Thanks green18. I had to put my 2 cents in when I saw this thread. You can call me Peter.

 

As long as it isn't a moderator for cause. If you intend to do so, read the rules at least twice before starting a petition that involves an off-site registration or such, and only post it as a thread once! So think it out first. If you are involved as the originator of the petition , mentioning it more than once is also 'self-promotion. Multiple threads are also a violation.

Such a petition should involve your elected political representatives. No organization , even ANA, PCGS, NGC, nor any auction house or coin website has 1/10 of the power.

Why do I have a feeling some social media high school or college teacher gave assignments to start a political petition and see how many people they can convince. Something doesn't seem right..

 

That very same thing crossed my mind last night.

 

Well we can't confirm this until more people show up with proposed changes to alter the coin collecting reality.

 

Here is one such assignment ( not on coins, bullions or treasury

http://shrei.stanford.edu/sites/shrei.stanford.edu/files/Ni_Presentation.pdf

 

VCC was never "criticized" until he refused to respond to "constructive criticism" of his petition(s). Failure to respond in an honest manner will never generate support.

VCC's only responses were that everybody here, who did not support this idea, were wrong.

That's not the way to make some great friends who are more than willing to help and assist in any coin endeavor.

If VCC could not respond with the appropriate arguments to the peons on this and other forums, how could he ever expect to gain support for a petition which, quite frankly, would go nowhere since it was directed at the wrong individual(s) due in part to his ignorance on the subject matter. And before the feathers come up in defense, look up ignorance which basically mean that he has no clue on how things really work.

Young folks and new collectors are ALWAYS welcome on CT and many other coin forums but when the young folks and new collectors begin to ignore responses and questions in favor of pushing their chosen causes, it's all over.

As for the petitions themselves, this group of "we" and "many young folks" (which simply do not exist and we all know this) has failed to garner any attention at all. Yesterday's 6 signature, which could be presumed to be VCC and 5 other people, has jumped to 7 signatures despite getting "coverage by Numismatic News".

Look, folks are willing to change and folks are most certainly welcoming but folks also refuse to deal with presumptuous individuals. Young, old or anywhere in between.

 

Ya know Jim, I had a sociology instructor back in the '70's who would send us out in the streets doing all kinds of weird things. Do the odd thing and try to get a reaction.....then document the experience. Fun stuff weirding out all them folks back then.

 

I was going to ask you what you did, but then I decided I really didn't want to know.

 

I don't mean to offend the OP, but this is just a ridiculous undertaking. Whats more ridiculous, is the petition. I just read it, and it's so useless, it's actually funny. Just give it up. If your fellow collectors see it as a useless attempt, don't you think you should take the COLLECTORS advice???