NGC Ten Year Grade Guaranty on Copper

I own several nice pieces in NGC holders. I recently acquired a very old copper that resides in NGC plastic. Looking at the certification page there is a blurb that tells me copper grades are only valid for ten years. Never seen that blurb before. Considering I am sure this piece will stay in my collection until I leave this party, does one have to go through the resubmission process at the end of ten years?

 

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I'm assuming that is there to cover them if there is any sort of corrosion/toning/whatever that occurs after that 10 years.
Sounds like an insurance policy on their part and possibly a money-grabbing scheme to get you to pay money to resubmit the coin again.
One more reason I despise TPGs

 

@furryfrog02 , TPGs don't make money unless you are sending the coins in again and again to be graded. Most US coins worth slabbing have already been slabbed, which is why TPGs have now moved on to grading bullion, and why their grade warranties are now limited, and why they offer new little services every few years. They don't make money if people don't resubmit, so they are going to do everything they can to get your business again.

 

Which is why I refuse to use their services. I own 3 graded coins. One was given to me in a trade a few years back and the other 2 were freebies that PCGS mailed out a few years ago. I think they were ATB quarters.
I would rather learn the process myself and be able to accurately grade a coin than pay someone else to do it, and re-do it, and re-do it, ad-infinitum.
Also one more reason I really enjoy ancient coins.

 

So that walk on the dark side is suiting you?

 

The NGC limitation on copper coins has been around for at least 10 years that I can remember. None of the TPG's can control the conditions under which slabs are stored, and copper is very reactive to the climate. It's not that NGC is trying to "lure" customers into resubmitting their slabbed coins so they can make more money. It's more important to NGC that they don't pay out too much in claims under the grade guarantee when copper coins are not stored in the most ideal conditions.

Chris

 

It is. Don't get me wrong, I love roll searching still...

 

Slabs are not air-tight. And as @cpm9ball and @GDJMSP wrote, copper is reactive.

There's the story (true) of the dealer who dipped a Peace dollar while it was in its slab. The only problem was that he couldn't rinse it very well, and he couldn't get it to dry at all. So he put it in his microwave to heat it. The plastic melted.

But did it CAC after that treatment? Who cares?

I love slabs SO much.

 

Slabs are great for proofs and red copper. You can tape the slab to a bottle of Maalox. Take a peek take a sip.

Honestly, I don't know why they ever guaranteed copper in the first place. Especially with all the collectors who live in Florida. There is only one direction that "pretty" can go. Thanks, but I'll take a brown EF40.

 

With NGC, send the coin in for reholdering service. It forces them to do a designation review and then restarts the clock.

 

Thats what I was looking for. Thanks

 

No problem. Also, I've done this myself a couple times, and customer service confirmed that the designation review happens when you do this. Of course the coin can get reholdered with a downgrade on the color if it's turned since the initial slabbing.

 

At first they guaranteed the grade on the coins, then they limited the color designation to 10 years, now they limit the guarantee on the grade itself to 10 years. As mentioned a reholdering before the 10 years runs out resets the clock. How long that option will last is anyone's guess.

PCGS on the other hand dropped their guarantee on the color designation completely at the same time NGC limited it to 10 years.

 

Have to agree here. Its CYA.
Why wouldnt a coin sealed in its container be good forever?
Only thing I can think of happening is toning
But, theoretically, toning should have no effect. Its not wear or damage.
Strange

 

I could understand the NGC position on Red copper and even R&B copper. If you don't store that material properly, bad things can happen. When it comes to brown copper, the problems are less and their position is a bit disappointing.

The truth is market perception is the main value the grading services provide. Their guarantees are murky. I once had a claim with PCGS over gold coin that had been treated with iodine. They treated me fairly, but it took a while for the wheels to turn.

This position from NGC on copper really means that they don’t seem to back anything after ten years. In a way the Chain Cent I have in NGC holder that they graded in 2001 is almost a raw coin. That is disturbing and disappointing.

 

I tried to copy the verbiage from the NGC verification. Hope this works.


Copper Coins Notice: Coins made of copper, bronze, brass or are copper-plated can change over time. Accordingly, with regard to copper, bronze, brass or copper-plated coins graded by NGC, the grade portion will no longer apply after the 10 year anniversary of their date of encapsulation by NGC. This coin was encapsulated on 5/7/2019 and the grade guarantee will expire on 5/7/2029. If the grade guarantee has not expired, it may be extended by submitting the coin under NGC's ReHolder service tier. If the grade guarantee has expired, the coin will be treated as a raw (ungraded) submission if resubmitted to NGC.

 

In the future, if you decide to sell something like your Chain Cent, a buyer willing to spend that kind of money will evaluate the coin, not whether it was graded in 2001 or in 2020. I'm sure if the coin was genuine in 2001 it will still be genuine in 2020; that would to me be the only issue.

 

A reholder will do just fine. It is 10 years from the date of encapsulation and not necessarily grading. That's what NGC told me previously.

 

That's newer language. No mention was made of reholdering on the site before.