On an earlier thread someone wrote that he was new to ancient coin collecting and was wondering what was the best way to learn how to ID ancient Roman coins. I think it was Doug Smith who suggested buying some small lots of inexpensive coins and trying to ID them. A link on a different thread about a different topic led to the eBay seller ancient_treasures. In scrolling his listings, I noticed that he had several lots of late Roman bronzes (LRBs) up for auction. Most of these coins are from the 3th & 4th century C.E., and in decent shape. They all look like they would be attributable with a little detective work. My guess is that most or all of these lots will end up going for between, $50 - $100 working out to around $5 - $10 per coin. I have no association with this seller, other than having bought a few coins from him in the past. But if you are looking for some ancient coins to develop your identification skills with, I think any of these 9-coin lots would serve you well. Here's a link to one example lot: http://www.ebay.com/itm/LOT-OF-9-ROMAN-BRONZE-COINS-/202058018423 You'll see other, similar lots if you check out this seller's store: http://stores.ebay.com/ANCIENT-TREASURES?_trksid=p2047675.l2563
I believe I also suggested that there is a lot of free practice available without buying a single thing. The groups linked above would be perfect for this. The photos are reasonable (not great) but clear enough to allow ID. Somee time ago I offended the world by posting a Quiz on ancient coins. It was intended to be difficult and not to yield to Google searching. I have not tried the new image search routines on these coins. Beginners who are most definitely ready for the quiz could use the images for ID practice. http://www.forumancientcoins.com/dougsmith/quiz.html Below is one image from that page. If you want ID practice, ignore my questions and just see what you can say about each coin. Click to enlarge. I would be happy to produce similar images not limited to late Romans for use in ID practice IF I thought there would be anyone interested enough in learning from photos. Would that be a waste of time?
I don't think it's a waste. Even for intermediate collectors like myself, I find practise helps keep the eye sharp.
I have been finding IDing a fun pass time and would love the chance to practice it using images like that. And maybe then comparing notes with other "ID practicers" that are IDing the same coin(s) to see what we each came up with and what the process/tools were they used. I've bought some small lots of uncleaned coins for this purpose, but like most only find 10% attributable (fully knowing this going in, and only spending $1/coin). And as people get more advanced/experienced, it's also useful as practice testing your skills at attribution WITHOUT any reference to begin with, based on what you can see and remember from past researching. Like at first glance, coins B & F are from the Siscia mint.
I think that the only information that I think could be helpful beyond what you currently have in your example photo would be size and weight. Especially if we get into determining if it is a Sest, Dup, As, etc.
Doug, as a quick answer: NO, it would not be a waste of time. Myself, I find my time restricted and move quickly in decisions during my work life, as well as, regretfully, in my Hobby time too. Albeit, I see a LOT of focus on Empire coinage attributions, I have bookmarked and perused your pages for the wealth of information for some of the areas I focus. Have I read it all in detail? Regretfully, no I have not. However, your pages and thoughtful information have helped me a lot. I remember a few times you commented that you were concerned over possible fakes and repros in the Republican area. CT spends a lot of time on the Roman Empire... would love to see more of your sage advice in the Republican Era, especially since there are so many more Republic collectors that are on-board compared to when I first started watching CT. I may not be an expert in the Empire, but many of the tools, ideas, pointers, etc. that you offer have been good ideas for me when I am searching / exploring my areas of interest and focus. Yeah, bummer, you don't go after Etruria, Capua, Carthage, Libyan War, Italia, etc. odd areas that I would love your sage advice. Like the old Malt-o-Meal ads: "Good Stuff, Maynard!"
I think the main reason that so much more time is spent discussing Imperial coins is that they greatly outnumber Republican coins. I don't think there's any intention to slight them, it's just simple statistics. LRBs are the most plentiful, so they're the most affordable, so they're the most widely collected, so they're the most frequently discussed. I can understand how RR collectors might feel left out. Really, though, it's nothing personal folks. Nice coins.
Yeah, I know. I just enjoy the Republican Era and those entities that interacted with them as a fun area of History. Had it not been for the ground-breaking struggles of the Republic, there would not had been an Empire. RR Aes Grave Uncia 269-240 BCE Astragalus knuckle-bones RR Anon 234-231 BCE AR Didrachm Apollo-Horse prancing Crawford 26-1 Sear 28
@dougsmit had to go ahead and post that....now I'm not only held hostage to the "big bag o romans" from the contest, but now this too. Gee thanks, @dougsmit, wanna come to my house and kick my dog too?
You really don't want my 'sage advise' on Republicans. I know rather little about them. I have tried and tried to get interested in them; I have bought quite a few but I can not get over the feeling i developed in college about the period. I was a Classics major studying mostly Greece and Rome. I have absolutely no respect for Cicero and a few hundred wannabe oligarchs pretending they are continuing the 'good works' started by Cincinnatus and other semi-legendary Romans (whose main accomplishment was keeping those pesky plebs under control). The emperors were at least honest about being power hungry, monsters and fools. CT has quite a few people who specialize in RR coins and are proud of their collections of them. Perhaps one of them will help. Post your questions and see.
LOL, sounds great Doug! Thank you! Looks like NO government is the ideal. Looks like it is just Human Nature.
So, I thought about this for a few seconds and the following occurred to me: Assume that (1) you're unfamiliar with the coins, (2) they're almost impossible to find via an Internet search, and (3) you don't own extensive books or printed references. How the heck are you supposed to identify them?
Simple, actually. You read the legends and look those up either online or in a book. You also pay attention to who wears one type headgear and who does not. The questions were not for absolute beginners but for people who have learned that the legends and other details are there for a reason. On late Romans, for example, we need to recognize that DN, PF and AVG are titles so the ruler name in between them. We learn that Constantine had sons with similar names so you have to pay attention to every letter. Earlier, we learn that Titus and Vespasian had the same name but Vespasian never used the T or spelled out TITVS while Titus always did. We learn that rulers often used a predecessor's name as part of his own name so a coin inscribed TRAIAN is not Trajan if the next word is HADRIANVS. The quiz was not to teach these things but to separate things we knew from things we need to research. One difficult thing we need to learn is that it is not realistic to expect to get 100% on a quiz unless you have been doing the homework. After I posted that page Google has developed software that can evaluate an image and show other similar images. Like any learning, baby steps come first and I do not know where they stand now. I would be impressed if I showed them a denarius and they showed me denarii. In a few years they might recognize the difference between a Septimius and a Caracalla. Separating Caracalla from Elagabalus might take longer. I suspect they are more interested in working on telling a beagle from a bulldog. Search engines have ruined traditional school type quizzes asking questions like "'When did Septimius die?" My page was to demonstrate questions that required human thought. By teaching their computer to read coin legends and providing a list of all known legends, they will beat my quiz.
OK, so now I have two questions: 1. By "...not yield to Google searching..." did you mean specifically Google's image searching? (If you can read the legends -- see my second question below -- you can Google the legends themselves.) I was unaware that Google could search images. 2. If one's visual acuity/ability to read the legends is lacking, are larger pictures available? Speaking for myself, unless a picture is of the size I illustrate below (click to enlarge to the size I need), I'm almost always unable to actually read the obverse legend.
https://images.google.com/ On the above page, click on the little camera and upload an image you want to find. It is a work in progress. Most beginners seem to have trouble reading legends because the 'fonts' used on coins and poor conditions make it hard to search. Large images are a good idea but limits the number of examples that can be fit on a page. Have you tried this trick: Right click and select Open image in New Tab; press and hold ctrl while you roll the mouse wheel forward. The image gets larger but less sharp since it can not interpolate the intermediate values.
