Log in or Sign up
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
World Coins
>
Netherlands - Gorinchem. Rose Noble, ND (1583-91).
>
Reply to Thread
Message:
<p>[QUOTE="GDJMSP, post: 1536629, member: 112"]They are pretty much all over the place, on the obv they are most noticeable close to the edges, in the shield area, and the rose area. On the rev close to the edges, and where the details are weakest in the upper, central part of the coin. </p><p><br /></p><p>Now it is important to understand something. What I think are casting bubbles appear as small dark dots and or pits on the coin. There are only 2 things that cause these small pits - air bubbles that rise to the surface when the molten metal is cast in the mold, and corrosion. But this coin was minted in what is essentially pure gold, and gold does not corrode. So logic dictates they must be casting bubbles.</p><p><br /></p><p>And the entire surface of the coin is very rough and uneven where it should be smooth. This is also an indicator common to poorly made cast copies. Look at the other two coins already pictured in this thread. Eduard's was buried in the ground, possibly for hundreds of years. But yet it shows no sign of corrosion or those small pits. The other coin of course, Conrad's, in the first post of this thread, is almost pristine. And I am posting pics of the example I used to own so you can examine it as well. But by looking at those 3 coins and examining the coin's surface, and then comparing it to yours, you should easily see what I mean by the surface of yours being very rough.</p><p><br /></p><p>This is the coin I used to own - </p><p><br /></p><p>[ATTACH]204321.vB[/ATTACH]</p><p><br /></p><p>[ATTACH]204322.vB[/ATTACH]</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>There are many differences in the design details of your coin from the known genuine examples. The ones you mention are but a few. As for variations, I only know of 7 examples of this coin that exist in the entire world, 3 of them are pictured in this thread. And all 3 of them are the same with the only difference being on Eduard's coin and the lines under the rose. Other than that one difference they are the same in design details. But yours is entirely different. And as I said before, I have seen pictures of 6 out of the 7 known examples, and they were all the same in every detail, except that one small thing on Eduard's. And that may be due to the fact that Eduard's was bent and folded, and we just can't see the other line under the rose.</p><p><br /></p><p>So, with only 7 examples known to exist, there are no known variations.</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>Delmonte wrote what is considered to be, and has been for decades, the definitive book on this type of coinage - Le Bennelux D'or. In it he provided a rarity scale for the coins he listed in his book. The scale is quite simple.</p><p><br /></p><p>R = Not Common</p><p>R.1 = Rare</p><p>R. 2 = Very Rare</p><p>R. 3 = Extremely Rare</p><p>R. 4 - Of the highest rarity (only 2 or 3 specimens known to exist)</p><p>Unique = 1 known</p><p><br /></p><p>That's all there is to know about the scale.</p><p><br /></p><p>Now rather obviously, as time goes by things change. Delmonte wrote his book almost 50 years ago. When I bought my coin there were only 2 or 3 examples known to exist. Then Conrad found his, then Eduard posted about his, and in the subsequent years a few others surfaced in coin auctions. But those are the only examples that I am aware of in the entire world - as I said, a total of 7 known.</p><p><br /></p><p>So if your coin is genuine, which based on the info I have I doubt it is, then yes, it would most definitely be rare for it would be 1 of only 8 examples known to exist in the world.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="GDJMSP, post: 1536629, member: 112"]They are pretty much all over the place, on the obv they are most noticeable close to the edges, in the shield area, and the rose area. On the rev close to the edges, and where the details are weakest in the upper, central part of the coin. Now it is important to understand something. What I think are casting bubbles appear as small dark dots and or pits on the coin. There are only 2 things that cause these small pits - air bubbles that rise to the surface when the molten metal is cast in the mold, and corrosion. But this coin was minted in what is essentially pure gold, and gold does not corrode. So logic dictates they must be casting bubbles. And the entire surface of the coin is very rough and uneven where it should be smooth. This is also an indicator common to poorly made cast copies. Look at the other two coins already pictured in this thread. Eduard's was buried in the ground, possibly for hundreds of years. But yet it shows no sign of corrosion or those small pits. The other coin of course, Conrad's, in the first post of this thread, is almost pristine. And I am posting pics of the example I used to own so you can examine it as well. But by looking at those 3 coins and examining the coin's surface, and then comparing it to yours, you should easily see what I mean by the surface of yours being very rough. This is the coin I used to own - [ATTACH]204321.vB[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]204322.vB[/ATTACH] There are many differences in the design details of your coin from the known genuine examples. The ones you mention are but a few. As for variations, I only know of 7 examples of this coin that exist in the entire world, 3 of them are pictured in this thread. And all 3 of them are the same with the only difference being on Eduard's coin and the lines under the rose. Other than that one difference they are the same in design details. But yours is entirely different. And as I said before, I have seen pictures of 6 out of the 7 known examples, and they were all the same in every detail, except that one small thing on Eduard's. And that may be due to the fact that Eduard's was bent and folded, and we just can't see the other line under the rose. So, with only 7 examples known to exist, there are no known variations. Delmonte wrote what is considered to be, and has been for decades, the definitive book on this type of coinage - Le Bennelux D'or. In it he provided a rarity scale for the coins he listed in his book. The scale is quite simple. R = Not Common R.1 = Rare R. 2 = Very Rare R. 3 = Extremely Rare R. 4 - Of the highest rarity (only 2 or 3 specimens known to exist) Unique = 1 known That's all there is to know about the scale. Now rather obviously, as time goes by things change. Delmonte wrote his book almost 50 years ago. When I bought my coin there were only 2 or 3 examples known to exist. Then Conrad found his, then Eduard posted about his, and in the subsequent years a few others surfaced in coin auctions. But those are the only examples that I am aware of in the entire world - as I said, a total of 7 known. So if your coin is genuine, which based on the info I have I doubt it is, then yes, it would most definitely be rare for it would be 1 of only 8 examples known to exist in the world.[/QUOTE]
Your name or email address:
Do you already have an account?
No, create an account now.
Yes, my password is:
Forgot your password?
Stay logged in
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
World Coins
>
Netherlands - Gorinchem. Rose Noble, ND (1583-91).
>
Home
Home
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Activity
Recent Posts
Forums
Forums
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Posts
Competitions
Competitions
Quick Links
Competition Index
Rules, Terms & Conditions
Gallery
Gallery
Quick Links
Search Media
New Media
Showcase
Showcase
Quick Links
Search Items
Most Active Members
New Items
Directory
Directory
Quick Links
Directory Home
New Listings
Members
Members
Quick Links
Notable Members
Current Visitors
Recent Activity
New Profile Posts
Sponsors
Menu
Search
Search titles only
Posted by Member:
Separate names with a comma.
Newer Than:
Search this thread only
Search this forum only
Display results as threads
Useful Searches
Recent Posts
More...