Need Unbiased Advice

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by morezan, Nov 20, 2019.

  1. morezan

    morezan New Member

    Morning! I recently purchased some items through a well-established online auction company (not eBay). Been doing this for years and have rarely had any issues with the items until I ran into this one. Not going to say which auctioneer it is until I have given him a chance at redemption. In the meantime I would really like an honest opinion of the item description. You can leave out the " We told you so's...." I also know some of you may Google the description, find out who the consignee is, an have had past dealings with him. Please focus on the description only and let me know what you think.

    Based on the following: would it be reasonable to assume these rolls were part of the cash reserves of a failed bank?

    "Description ***Auction Highlight*** Morgan/Peace $1 Mixed Roll Steel Strong
    Shotgun Wrapper w/Covered Ends. Great Original Roll of Morgan &
    Peace Dollars. The Two ends are covered.ÊAny dates & any condition
    possible inside. Note you will receive a roll completely similar to the
    photo. We have a large hoard of these rolls & they all look exactly alike.
    We have had great feedback on the rolls so far.Ê Some lucky bidders
    have gotten key dates & PL's. The roll is held in an old "Steel Strong
    Automatic" Wrapper Dated from 1921. The Roll is also faintly stamped
    "Banker Trust of Philadelphia, Central City Oice, Walnut Street at
    Juniper". I researched that name and the Bank closed in the post-Crash
    of '29 Depression period (my research showed that it failed on Dec 22,
    1930). We received this incredible consignment from a private collector.
    The consignee gave us his father's entire estate hoard of shotgun rolled
    coins."

    Thanks for looking!
     
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  3. Seattlite86

    Seattlite86 Outspoken Member

    DO NOT BUY!!!

    The text is intentionally misleading. I lost a lot of money some years ago falling prey to these schemes. Note the particular words "held in an old wrapper dated..." it does not say "this wrapper came from the Banker Trust of Philadelphia". "Any dates & any condition possible inside" meaning if you get a bunch of 1921 Morgan dollars that are all culls, the description is still accurate. These people pepper their rolls with a couple good coins to hype them up, then sell the rest overpriced. It's been going on for years. Smart of you to ask before clicking buy; I wish I was as smart as that.
     
    Magnus87, spirityoda, wxcoin and 2 others like this.
  4. cpm9ball

    cpm9ball CANNOT RE-MEMBER

    Why are you reluctant to name the auction company?

    Chris
     
  5. furryfrog02

    furryfrog02 Well-Known Member

    Sounds just like the scams that sellers on ebay run. Wouldn't touch that with a 10ft pole.
     
    mlov43, Magnus87 and spirityoda like this.
  6. okbustchaser

    okbustchaser Just plain busted

    Sorry, but where is the "scam" here (or with the Ebay sales that you reference)? The consignee is offering exactly what he says he is...if treasure hunters are attracted to the bait that is on them--NOT THE SELLER!

    Do I think that a 1893 S is going to show up--or even an 1894 S for that matter? Of course not, but the dream is why treasure hunters exist.
     
    Magnus87 and LA_Geezer like this.
  7. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    Well, the seller certainly hopes that there are potential buyers who think so. But:

    1) As others have said in this thread, it's easy to buy "old-looking" roll stock and crimping tools.

    2) If you read the description very carefully, it does not say that these rolls are anything other than newly-assembled. (The word "original" could mean anything.) So the seller isn't even lying, technically.

    3) Read this thread on another site for more detailed information.
     
  8. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Ehhhh, yes and no. I am a very strong believer in personal responsibility, meaning everyone is responsible for their own actions. But there's 2 actions here - one by the seller and one by the buyer. And both are responsible for those actions.

    The seller is "guilty" because he is intentionally using advertising that is designed to be misleading so that he can take advantage of the gullible, ignorant, uneducated, and misinformed.

    The buyer is "guilty" because he is not doing his homework and buying something he knows nothing about, and buying it from a complete stranger.

    That said, the actions of the one in no way diminishes the responsibility of the other.

    To the OP:

    When you see ads like this, think of the commercials you see on TV. You know the ones I mean, where they show these beautiful coins saying they are plated in pure gold. And you can buy one for only $19.95 - and with free shipping !

    Well what those ads don't tell you is that the coin has about 39 cents worth of gold on it an the rest is nothing but cheap base metal. The actual value of this coin is maybe, maybe $1. But people buy them by the tens of thousands.

    Would you ? Well, same thing goes for those rolls.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2019
    Jeffjay, Magnus87, buckeye73 and 6 others like this.
  9. LA_Geezer

    LA_Geezer Well-Known Member

    Or you could let Mezak gouge the life out of you with all of those common items that he calls rare or could possibly become very valuable.
     
  10. okbustchaser

    okbustchaser Just plain busted

    And if I use a certain spray cologne I'm going to have to know martial arts to fight off all the women who are going to attack...If I drink a certain beer I am going to be the most popular guy in the singles bar...if I so on and so forth.

    Advertising is misleading by design; Short of actual fraud if one is taken in by it then that is on him.
     
  11. CoinCorgi

    CoinCorgi Derp, derp, derp!

    Not reasonable at all. This is where they came from...
    All you can glean from this quote...
    is that the coins are in old wrappers. Period. End of facts.

    Anything else that you make up is...well...not factual.
     
    Stevearino likes this.
  12. wxcoin

    wxcoin Getting no respect for 64 years

    I think I tried that cologne. Unfortunately, all that seemed attracted to me was my neighbor's cows.
     
    Mainebill, mlov43, Stevearino and 5 others like this.
  13. wxcoin

    wxcoin Getting no respect for 64 years

    There are all sorts of "gimmick" wording to sell coins. Some of the most sensational one I remember include:

    An elderly lady who worked at a bank in Buffalo collected coins that came into the bank she worked at for 40 years. She now want to sell them. Of course, she put semi key dates on the ends of rolls, some had a quarter eagle on the end, S mint IHC on the ends, ...

    A current seller on eBay is selling coins found in an old safe found in a 200+ year old pottery shop....

    If it sounds too good to be true its too good to be true.
     
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  14. John Burgess

    John Burgess Active Member

    Yes it is reasonable to assume it is part of the cash reserves of a failed bank based on the description. It's meant to give you that impression. it's what the seller is implying.
    I stuck to the question. LOL


    is it true? Probably not, just one of 1000 possible scenarios for the rolls existence. It's just as likely to be full of 18 Ikes and a morgan and peace dollar ender, and was rolled up last week by a guy named Sally.
     
  15. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    That's the 200+ year old pottery shop with the old safe that contained TPG-slabbed coins, right? :rolleyes:
     
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  16. ToughCOINS

    ToughCOINS Dealer Member Moderator

    I think you got exactly what was listed . . . so does the seller.

    By the way, I've never met someone who was intently listening to advice while plugging both ears with his fingers.
     
    CoinCorgi likes this.
  17. PlanoSteve

    PlanoSteve Well-Known Member


    Well,..."*"...! o_O















    "*" = "We told you so..." ;)
     
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  18. Mountain Man

    Mountain Man Well-Known Member

    OP already did. :(
     
    Seattlite86 likes this.
  19. Mountain Man

    Mountain Man Well-Known Member

    The consignee gave us his father's entire estate hoard of shotgun rolled
    coins. This says it all.
     
  20. jb10000lakes

    jb10000lakes New Member

    Run! "This is such a great buy that we aren't even going to look at them ourselves to see how much money we're losing by selling them this way" said no one ever.....
     
    Maxfli and PlanoSteve like this.
  21. juris klavins

    juris klavins Well-Known Member

    Anything over $450 for a roll is a ripoff - 'Steel Strong Automatic 1921' wrappers are readily available for $1 each, as many as you want (Are they authentic? Who knows?) - genuine Morgan dollars in lower grades (VG-VF) are being sold by Apmex for $20-$22, as many as you want - even with sales tax, you can assemble your own 'original bank roll' for well under $500, phony faded bank ID stamp included :D
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-Of-50-Steel-Strong-Automatic-Vintage-Coin-Wrappers-Red-Window-1921-Pat/254413978794?
    https://www.apmex.com/search?q=morgan+dollars&f_price=0+to+24&page=1
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2019
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