My new Carr :)

If you wish to quote me, sir; please do so exactly. I didn't say anything about using a marker, and was sure to use only modern technology for the example so it would better compare to how you produce your "overstrikes". You use a Peace dollar, and I used a can of Campbell's soup. With both an original design is copied using technology, ever so slightly altered (again, using technology), and then printed/struck over the original. You're certainly entitled to spin it any way you wish, but the comparison was completely valid, as much as is possible, using the Campbell's soup example you often present as a defense. If we're going to rehash this, let's at least be reasonable about it.

 

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For the most part, I have to respectfully disagree with you, other than with "choosing deliberately provocative verbiage because their position is governed by emotion" as this is exactly how I view the reactions of most fans. Time and time again completely logical posts are met with outright hostility from those who view anything but the undeniably positive as an attack on either themselves or something they like. It is human nature to defend what we do or like, so I can certainly understand where it's coming from, but stating something as simple as the essential designs are copied, which anyone with eyes can see to be true, often results in completely unnecessary accusations, excuses, and/or deflection. This isn't to say that there are not a few select individuals who are more than happy to chum the pond with baited words (counterfeit, etc), but such reactions should be reserved for them, and not those of us simply expressing reasonable opinions, views, or concerns on a discussion forum. JMMHO, of course.

Just as I said to the gentleman in the other thread, "haters" carries with it negative connotations and implies ignorance, even if not intended that way. Lumping those who disagree with you under such a blanket term would be like me referring to all fans as "ideologues", or to follow the slang-like lead "sheep", but I dont because it's not fair nor is it true. Think what you like, but I do not "hate" Mr. Carr or his creations, and I know I'm not alone in this on the opposing side. In fact, in threads past I have admitted to having great respect for his entrepreneurial spirit, and regularly give credit for his quality, but the fact I dislike his "overstrikes" does mean mean I "hate" them. If I just popped in to yell "counterfeit!" and leave, fine... call me a hater as that would be reasonable. Otherwise, do understand that using such a negative and arguably hostile term is likely to be met with equal hostility. Perhaps, if there was a little more respect given from BOTH sides, these threads wouldn't turn as ugly as they often do.

Believe it or not, I do appreciate the kind words, and to be totally honest, I cannot recall exactly where/when it started. Even though I may not always agree, I have complimented you, although some months ago, on your contributions as well. It does seem a waste time on or worry about something neither can quite remember.

Do as you see fit. If you feel there's something you need to apologize for, it is only right to do so, but if not, then it's unnecessary. I certainly wouldn't want one if it wasn't sincere, and can only assume that you would feel the same way if, say, coming from me; if insincere it isn't worth the breath it took to say, or the effort it takes to write it. With that said, if you wish to bury the hatchet, I'm perfectly willing and would much prefer to do so. In fact, I give you great credit for speaking your mind and reaching across the aisle.

What you do have my apologies for is the time it took me to respond. My intent was not to ignore you, but I haven't had the free time to (at least somewhat) properly respond until now.

 

Research who designed the Washington Quarter and look to see if his initials are on it now. Never hear a gripe about that one.

 

I did quote you exactly (verbatim cut/paste).
Regardless, in both cases, the end result is NOT a copy of the original, it is an alteration of the original. The can still has the original label on it, except that it was over-printed.

If you make your own can of soup using your own ingredients and your own pieces of metal and put your own copy of a Campbell's label on it, THEN it becomes a copy (or counterfeit) of a can of Campbell's soup.

My previous automobile analogy still applies.

Another reason this comparison fails is that I never claimed that the original coins that I over-struck were my "own work". In fact, the certificates that I provide with them state the name of the original designer. I only claim that I have over-struck them using a fantasy date.

Like it or not, my fantasy-date over-strikes have become recognized numismatic items in their own right.

 

The same is true for the reverse as well from people who have decided they are the ultimate source of the law ect. In the end its the internet and a lot of people are just their to sling mud and resort to personal attacks instead of having a real debate.

While you aren't alone, you are unfortunately in the minority. We've both seen past posts and threads and there are a lot of "statements" that really should be presented as opinions but from the response you would think it was the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court responding. That gets very old very fast so you will get lumped in with that for the most part given you're in the minority as someone who seems to actually be interested in a debate and not just forcing opinions on people.

 

What the hell are you talking about? John Flanigan, and after luckily being able to dig up a 2015.... voila! Still there, right where it should be on the obverse, giving credit for what of his, even if only in resemblance, remains where credit is due.

If I'm missing something, do educate me.

 

I guess I should have said State Quarters but in any case Most of the artists who designed them aren't credited for their work. Also because he moved moto on the obverse design William Cousins added his initials to those on the bust. Anyway it's not new news, but most don't know many of the artists who designed the coins never get the credit. Only the guy who copied it.
Interesting read.
http://www.scvhistory.com/orig/scvhistory/signal/coins/worden-coinage1205a.htm

 

Heh. We're arguing about one of them.

That would be nice, wouldn't it?

 

Maybe one of these days we can persuade Mr. Carr to get a space and attend the Baltimore Whitman Coin show. That'd be a treat.