My latest just arrived...

Hi, can you give us a date for when your pl restrike will be available for purchase ? Thanks.

 

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By early next week, I think.

 

6 months house arrest + federal felony conviction + 3 years probation and only because the judge considered the specific facts of his case and thought the sentencing guidelines were too harsh. The judge let him off of probation after 1 year upon the granting of the defendant's motion. The judge's rationale was more or less that he wasn't trying to counterfeit or break the law, but did what he did for political/philosophical reasons.

 

That's interesting because some of the same arguments/type of arguments made are similar to the ones that you make all the time like no intent to defraud, no similarity, no one would be confused, etc.

P.S. I agree with you that the Von Nothaus court took the law a little too far. Ditto for Delmarco. Nevertheless, there are clear violations and when there are only minimal differences (like changing a date), I agree with the two courts that both the HPA and title 18 statutes come into play.

 

Excellent, thanks.

 

I will be tempted.

 

No, there are significant differences in the "arguments".

Von NotHaus:
Attempted to convince merchants to accept Liberty Dollars as legal tender and/or claiming that they were better than legal tender. This amounted to "uttering" which, arguably, is a form of fraudulent intent.

National Collectors Mint:
Engaged in highly misleading marketing for the "Freedom Tower Silver Dollar" stating that it was a government-issue dollar and implying that it was solid silver recovered from the WTC site. It was actually neither.

So both of the above clearly involved an intentional misrepresentation of the item.
And neither of the above was an over-strike (alteration) to existing genuine coins.

 

Sorry, not much chance of that
I would not over-strike any 1895 Morgan, nor would I over-strike any Morgan AS an "1895".

 

I guess I should have used an emoji. I really didn't think anyone would think for a minute I was being serious.

 

But again, you are cherry picking the record and not telling the full story. Von Nothaus was convicted of uttering, but he was also convicted of designing and producing the coins which are separate offenses even under the same statute. That is clear legally. The court then analyzed his arguments under the production/design portion of the statute and rejected arguments that are on par with your arguments especially regarding intent and the items not looking like genuine issues.

As for Delmarco, again, yes, they did other stuff, but it wasn't the only violation in the proceeding. If you look at that decision, the court specifically addressed your design for the coin and found that the design itself was a violation of the HPA.

Overstriking a coin doesn't meaningfully distinguish Delmarco either as the plain meaning of the language of the HPA and the relevant Code of Federal Regulations sections unequivocally provide that alterations of this nature are also imitation numismatic items so as to invoke the marking requirement, and then there is the case law that you ignore that says that overstriking genuine coins is not enough to remove the resulting pieces from the counterfeiting statutes IF the remainder of the elements of the offense are there. You can argue about the other elements all you want, but overstriking a genuine coin itself does not in and of itself render the resulting coin legitimate and not-counterfeit.

Edit:
Wait a minute... How did I end up being baited into responding to your works again in this thread? I was trying to be nice to the OP, but cannot allow you to spread misinformation.

 

How can a design, on its own, violate the HPA? So, if I say drew that design in a sketch book it would violate the HPA?

 

You can't allow? Are you legally bound ? Lol. (I'm guessing you feel moraly bound) You are correct though, I think that this thread is about how nice these RESTRIKES are, and not another legality thread.

 

I have a novel idea, why doesn't someone create a legality thread or whatever they want to call it like the NGC boards did and then we can keep all of this to that thread and just let people have their threads sharing their new purchase without the same song and dance every-time.

 

Or Dan's supporters can stop spreading mistruths about the law, and then there won't need to be a discussion about legality at all. The subject matter was raised by one of his supporters IIRC.

 

Yeah, we all get that. That ridiculous Grease error thread by USMC60 is testament that any amount of crazy is tolerated as long as the outdated rules here are strictly adheared to.

 

Proof Morgan overstrikes now available! I predict a sell out by end of day. Act fast. TC

 

Just orderd mine

 

Same here.