My first tetrarchic nummus - Maximinus II as Caesar from Trier!

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Claudius_Gothicus, Sep 7, 2021.

  1. Orange Julius

    Orange Julius Well-Known Member

    Great input again! I do appreciate it. If you'd try to summarize the last 10 years of modern politics by what you see on coins, I suppose you'd be missing even more of the story (although you've provided some excellent details!). I'm sure there's a lot of back story that we're missing that I'd love to read if some day a dusty parchment is found.

    I have two interesting coins from Constantine's London mint that are interesting. For both Maximinus and Licinius, the "F" is missing in the usual IMP _____ PF AVG formula for both, only stating IMP _____ P AVG. Although scarce coins, this legend showing up on multiple dies for at least two Augusti, means it's probably not a mistake.

    So here's to the Pius but hopefully not Lucky eastern Augusti.

    MaximinusIILondonRICVI211.JPG
    Maximinus II
    310-312 AD
    IMP MAXIMINVS P AVG, laureate, cuirassed bust right
    GENIO-POP ROM, Genius standing left, turret on head, loins draped, holding patera and cornucopiae. Star in right field.
    Mintmark PLN.
    RIC VI London 211 var.
    LiciniusILondonRICVI209cvar.JPG
    Licinius I
    310-312 AD
    IMP MAXIMINVS P AVG, laureate, cuirassed bust right
    GENIO-POP ROM, Genius standing left, turret on head, loins draped, holding patera and cornucopiae. Star in right field.
    Mintmark PLN.
    UNLISTED OBVERSE LEGEND. Not attested for this issue. Listed in Huvelin (no. 106). Listed in Cloke-Toone (7.05.010). Should be listed in RIC after LONDINIUM 210.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2021
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  3. Heliodromus

    Heliodromus Well-Known Member

    What's great about coins of this imperial time period is that there is at least a good amount of "current events" reflected on the coinage. Some explicit and some implicit if you look at irregularities that are best explained by geographical proximity and current relations.

    I don't think we can read anything into these abbreviated legends - there are so many variations, especially here from London, that I can only suppose it was left up to the engravers to abbreviate as necessary.

    For Constantine himself, we see pretty much every possible abbreviation, in addition to an IN(VICTVS) thrown in there, likely also on whim of some engraver.

    IMP C PF AVG
    IMP C P AVG
    C PF IN AVG
    C PF AVG
    C P AVG
    C P AG
    C AVG
    C AG
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2021
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  4. Gavin Richardson

    Gavin Richardson Well-Known Member

    num-num-num-num-num…
    1A362AEE-6700-4B0C-B72D-3EA20B183957.jpeg
     
  5. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

    Maximinus with Serapis/Genius reverse. (One of the last times this deity appears on Roman coinage)

    maximinus3.jpg

    maximinus4.jpg
     
  6. Heliodromus

    Heliodromus Well-Known Member

    That's a great shot! I'm a big fan of multi-coin photos.

    Tough to get so many varied patinas all decently exposed at the same time.
     
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  7. Orange Julius

    Orange Julius Well-Known Member

    Oh yeah, I totally agree. After some wine and this thread, I just found it funny that two legend variations for other Augusti leave out the "F" for Felix or lucky. I'm sure there are Constantine coins out there with similar abbreviations as you mention and it probably doesn't mean anything significant. I was just dreaming of days in the far past when someone said... just because we're obligated to mint coins for someone, doesn't mean we have to wish them luck.
     
  8. Heliodromus

    Heliodromus Well-Known Member

    I guess insulting by omission of honorifics might have been a bit too subtle, and anyways a bit futile given that with all these abbreviations the recipient would never know if they were being insulted or not (else, what's the point?!).

    The Constantinian period, with it's backstabbing rule-of-many, did provide an interesting opportunity for numismatic insults and flattery though, and it's interesting how often they did resort to it. The coinage was not only a way to feed your propaganda to the masses, but also a way to send messages to your peers!

    One thing that has always struck me about this is the need to deliver the message to the recipients, especially when they were being flattered. It seems highly unlikely one emperor would have any awareness of what another emperor was putting on his coins (especially bronze, but gold too) unless he was made aware of it, so I believe they must have from time to time (when something new was introduced) sent samples of coins to each other to make sure the message was received.

    The most obvious type of message was whether you recognized another emperor on your coins, which of course was the norm between the legitimate co-rulers, but was also used by usurpers looking to be accepted such as Carausius, Domitius Domitianus, or Maxentius' initial appeal to Maximinus (with whom he had no alliance).

    There are many examples in the Constantinian era of coinage being used for flattery, but not many, other than simple omission, that I can think of where it was used for insults.

    One very notable insult usage was Constantine's "new world order" coinage from Lyons in 307-308 (the CONCORDIA PERPET issue, RIC 250 etc), where Constantine attempts to boost his own legitimacy by demoting Galerius from senior to "IVN AVG" junior augustus !!

    Here's my beat-up example of RIC VI Lyons 254 with this "IVN(IOR) AVG" title.

    IVN AVG.jpg

    I've got to wonder in this case if Constantine sent a sample to Galerius ?!

    In any case, Galerius was well aware of the deteriorating situation and so in late 308 convened his conference at Carnuntum where Maximianus was forced into re-retirement, Maxentius was denounced as enemy of the state, Constantine and Maximinus were "awarded" the title of FIL AVG, and Galerius' buddy Licinius was brought in as AVG. This immediately resulted in another example of "insult" coinage, with Maximinus showing his displeasure by coining for the just-denounced/retired Maximianus as an in-your-face insult to Galerius !

    Here's my examples of Maximinus' post-Carnuntum coinage for Maximianus, from both Antioch and Alexandria:

    RIC VI Antioch 112c

    Max Antoich.jpg

    RIC VI Alexandria 102 var

    Max Alexandria.jpg

    At Alexandria additional insult was added by noting Maximianus as SEN AVG, or "EN AVG" on this oddly abbreviated variation (indicating him as senior to the legitimate Galerius).

    Interesting to wonder who examples of these might have been sent to? Maybe to Constantine and Maximianus to show Maximinus's loyalty, maybe to Galerius to make sure it was not lost on him ?!

    I guess on the "insult" front we can also include the 1st civil war coinage of c.316 AD from Constantine and Licinius where they not only briefly stopped recognizing each other, but also modified the legends to be less inclusive (AVG vs AVGG).

    This topic - numismatic insults and flattery - really deserves a thread to itself. On the flattery front there are tons of examples.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2021
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