Morgan with a lot happening on the reverse & obverse

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Petercoin, Apr 18, 2024.

  1. Petercoin

    Petercoin Active Member

    Hope someone has
    some opinions on this Morgan dollar.
    Weight is 26.68 g, Sigma verification
    as 90% silver
    This coin is very exquisite in that ,look to be DMPL, has doubling and clash marking.
    Have a look
    I may have posted multiple times, I am older, but still learning
    Thanks 20240418_100121.jpg 20240418_100231.jpg
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  3. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    It looks frosty, but those are huge gouges on the obverse, and definitely PMD.:( I'm not sure what to make of the apparent multi-strike weirdness.
    ZoidMeister likes this.
  4. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    Major die cracks on the obverse and maybe some 'clashing' but from what I have no idea.......
  5. Collecting Nut

    Collecting Nut Borderline Hoarder

    I’m not sure those are clash marks. It is interesting but the obverse is a turn off due to the gouges. The reverse is a turn on because of the strike. It looks like the coin was struck on the reverse by the obverse die. A clash should have a different look.
    Coins4Eli likes this.
  6. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    Misplaced star between D& O in Dollar on reverse?
  7. Coins4Eli

    Coins4Eli Collector of Early American Copper

    Looks like it was struck, flipped and then struck again, but what do I know. Lets see what someone with more experience says. :)

    @Fred Weinberg @paddyman98
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2024
    longshot and ZoidMeister like this.
  8. Mr.Q

    Mr.Q Well-Known Member

    Odd, the coin appears to be bent. Obverse has environmental damage, reverse slightly less. Too bad the coin has such damage. All Morgans are collectable and yours is no exception, I like it.
  9. ZoidMeister

    ZoidMeister Hamlet Squire of Tomfoolery . . . . .

    Agreed. The doubled denticles on the lower obverse testify it is a double struck, flip over. The staple gouges however, are a heart-breaker . . . . .

    Coins4Eli likes this.
  10. longshot

    longshot Enthusiast Supporter

    And struck with no collar the second time? Diameter? Pretty unique looking, whatever it is.
  11. Mainebill

    Mainebill Bethany Danielle

    Bad scratches but definitely double struck. Almost wonder if the scratches was from prying it off the die it stuck to
    rte likes this.
  12. Evan8

    Evan8 A Little Off Center

    Possible double struck, but those look like staple scratches to me.
  13. rte

    rte Well-Known Member

    This is the story I would push for on the grading company label :D
    Coins4Eli likes this.
  14. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    He @Petercoin can you get us some better photos of the coin. Clear shots of the damage on the reverse AMER area. Those scratches have the same look as the obverse "damage".
    I haven't exactly put my finger on this as a genuine error or a fake made to decieve.

    Notice how the reverse final strike is so much further off center than the obverse strike? This is not common unless there were multiple strikes.

    What does the reeding look like?
  15. messydesk

    messydesk Well-Known Member

    On the surface, it looks like a flip-over double strike, 2nd strike out of collar, that has been damaged. If genuine, worth a lot, even with the damage. These sorts of errors have been faked, so the coin warrants a closer look. If the diameter is high, then the damage could have been incurred while jamming a counting machine. If it's attributable to a VAM number (try 19 or 26), that probably means genuine dies.

    From the pictures, I'd say send it to ANACS.
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2024
  16. Petercoin

    Petercoin Active Member

    I will do my best to get better picture, also the reeding
  17. Petercoin

    Petercoin Active Member

    I believe that ANACS has one of the foremost knowledgeable Morgan Dollar
    I remember his last name as Robert's
    Thanks for your advice.
  18. Petercoin

    Petercoin Active Member

    for your outlook, in hand the gouging does not look like it was caused by a staple (on obverse).
  19. Petercoin

    Petercoin Active Member

    For everyone who posted a reply,
    It is absolutely appreciated
    With gratitude for everyone's opinion.
    I will try my best to get better pitches so you can see what I see by holding this coin.
    I will add any new updates,
    again thank you everyone
    Best regards
    Pickin and Grinin and longshot like this.
  20. messydesk

    messydesk Well-Known Member

    John Roberts is their director of attribution services. We know each other quite well, as we've both been heavily involved with VAMs for a long time. He helps me with the Morgan part of the VAM catalog. He may or may not see this coin if submitted as an error. If the order tracking says "consultant," it means they sent it to him, as he's not located at ANACS' main office.
    Petercoin and Spark1951 like this.
  21. dcarr

    dcarr Mint-Master

    Genuine flip-over double-struck mint error.
    First strike in collar. Second strike out of collar (broad-struck).
    The lines on the obverse are deep scratches (damage).
    Scratches like that tend to happen to mint errors such as this because the coin's enlarged diameter causes them to get caught in the Mint machinery or later in a counting machine.

    Between 3:00 and 4:00 on the obverse is a shiny patch where the rubber feeding wheel in a counting machine did a "burn-out" on the coin.

    I would definitely submit the coin. It will likely come back with "damage" and/or "scratched" on the holder label. But it will also be labelled as a genuine flip-over double strike error.
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