Log in or Sign up
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Coin Chat
>
More on Grading & Grading Companies
>
Reply to Thread
Message:
<p>[QUOTE="Insider, post: 3800488, member: 24314"]You seem like a very informed member so I look forward to a long discussion. I have a copy of the copper grading guide and also highly recommend it.</p><p><br /></p><p>halfcent1793, posted: "And it's [1793 cent MS-69] carried in the early copper condition census as a MS60. [<i><span style="color: #b30000">IMHO both MS-69 and MS-60 are extremely <b>STUPID </b>grades for that coin<b>.</b></span></i>] As I noted, slabbers aren't very good at grading early copper. Plus, how can you grade a coin MS69 when there is nothing graded MS68 and only two coins have been graded higher than MS66?" </p><p><br /></p><p><i><span style="color: #b30000">You are showing an amount of <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie30" alt=":bucktooth:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> ignorance that surprises me! Coins have grades. There are many instances where a coin of one date/type is graded say MS-Something and the next closest coin is AU-Smething with no known graded coins in between! Try S-49 for example. It's a Large cent. </span></i> <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie7" alt=":p" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p>"I have read the "definitions" that the ANA and PCGS use for the higher mint state grades, and I am unable to tell what distinguishes them. However, I'm quite willing to learn." </p><p><br /></p><p><i><span style="color: #b30000">I'll agree with you that both sources leave something to be desired. Nevertheless, there is a good chart in the ANA Grading Guide for silver dollars that is very helpful. BTW, I offer personal or group grading classes.</span></i></p><p> </p><p>"Someone please explain to me how a coin struck in 1793 can possibly be equal in perfection to the finest modern coins struck with completely different technologies."</p><p><br /></p><p><i><span style="color: #b30000">A very thoughtful question with an easy answer: <b>IT CAN'T</b>!</span></i> <i><span style="color: #b30000"> I told you it was easy. That's why a grade of MS-69 on that coin is EXTREMELY <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie96" alt=":vomit:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> STUPID! It reminds me of a coin grading "roundtable" in the 1970's attended by some of the most knowledgeable, influential, numismatists/dealers at that time. The geniuses discussing the feasibility of a coin grading service at that table graded a "Photograde textbook XF 1794 Large cent from <b><span style="color: #660066">VF to AU</span></b> <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie57" alt=":jawdrop:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> and they had good reasons for their opinions! That being the case, what's a poor <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie5" alt=":confused:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> collector to do? </span></i></p><p><br /></p><p>halfcent1793, posted: "You're proposing what Early American Coppers already does. And we HAVE published our standards in the <i>Grading Guide for Early American Copper Coins</i>...I would add that none of the "services" actually seem to understand coinage by hand using a screw press."</p><p><br /></p><p><i><span style="color: #b30000">LOL, I won't comment on the wacky coin grading being done by a very tiny number of copper specialists as it has no relation <b>AT ALL</b> to a coin's actual condition as expressed by the vast majority of knowledgeable numismatists. BTW, that <b><span style="color: #660066">EXTREMELY FINE</span></b> 1794 cent was graded only<b> <span style="color: #660066">VF</span></b> by the EAC (Net Grading) standards. <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie12" alt="o_O" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /><img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie3" alt=":(" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> </span></i>[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="Insider, post: 3800488, member: 24314"]You seem like a very informed member so I look forward to a long discussion. I have a copy of the copper grading guide and also highly recommend it. halfcent1793, posted: "And it's [1793 cent MS-69] carried in the early copper condition census as a MS60. [[I][COLOR=#b30000]IMHO both MS-69 and MS-60 are extremely [B]STUPID [/B]grades for that coin[B].[/B][/COLOR][/I]] As I noted, slabbers aren't very good at grading early copper. Plus, how can you grade a coin MS69 when there is nothing graded MS68 and only two coins have been graded higher than MS66?" [I][COLOR=#b30000]You are showing an amount of :bucktooth: ignorance that surprises me! Coins have grades. There are many instances where a coin of one date/type is graded say MS-Something and the next closest coin is AU-Smething with no known graded coins in between! Try S-49 for example. It's a Large cent. [/COLOR][/I] :p "I have read the "definitions" that the ANA and PCGS use for the higher mint state grades, and I am unable to tell what distinguishes them. However, I'm quite willing to learn." [I][COLOR=#b30000]I'll agree with you that both sources leave something to be desired. Nevertheless, there is a good chart in the ANA Grading Guide for silver dollars that is very helpful. BTW, I offer personal or group grading classes.[/COLOR][/I] "Someone please explain to me how a coin struck in 1793 can possibly be equal in perfection to the finest modern coins struck with completely different technologies." [I][COLOR=#b30000]A very thoughtful question with an easy answer: [B]IT CAN'T[/B]![/COLOR][/I] [I][COLOR=#b30000] I told you it was easy. That's why a grade of MS-69 on that coin is EXTREMELY :vomit: STUPID! It reminds me of a coin grading "roundtable" in the 1970's attended by some of the most knowledgeable, influential, numismatists/dealers at that time. The geniuses discussing the feasibility of a coin grading service at that table graded a "Photograde textbook XF 1794 Large cent from [B][COLOR=#660066]VF to AU[/COLOR][/B] :jawdrop: and they had good reasons for their opinions! That being the case, what's a poor :confused: collector to do? [/COLOR][/I] halfcent1793, posted: "You're proposing what Early American Coppers already does. And we HAVE published our standards in the [I]Grading Guide for Early American Copper Coins[/I]...I would add that none of the "services" actually seem to understand coinage by hand using a screw press." [I][COLOR=#b30000]LOL, I won't comment on the wacky coin grading being done by a very tiny number of copper specialists as it has no relation [B]AT ALL[/B] to a coin's actual condition as expressed by the vast majority of knowledgeable numismatists. BTW, that [B][COLOR=#660066]EXTREMELY FINE[/COLOR][/B] 1794 cent was graded only[B] [COLOR=#660066]VF[/COLOR][/B] by the EAC (Net Grading) standards. o_O:( [/COLOR][/I][/QUOTE]
Your name or email address:
Do you already have an account?
No, create an account now.
Yes, my password is:
Forgot your password?
Stay logged in
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Coin Chat
>
More on Grading & Grading Companies
>
Home
Home
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Activity
Recent Posts
Forums
Forums
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Posts
Competitions
Competitions
Quick Links
Competition Index
Rules, Terms & Conditions
Gallery
Gallery
Quick Links
Search Media
New Media
Showcase
Showcase
Quick Links
Search Items
Most Active Members
New Items
Directory
Directory
Quick Links
Directory Home
New Listings
Members
Members
Quick Links
Notable Members
Current Visitors
Recent Activity
New Profile Posts
Sponsors
Menu
Search
Search titles only
Posted by Member:
Separate names with a comma.
Newer Than:
Search this thread only
Search this forum only
Display results as threads
Useful Searches
Recent Posts
More...