Mint Seek Return Of 1974-D Aluminum cent

I get it with the 1933 double eagle because it was not meant to be in circulation. What is the point of "getting back" something that was handed out as a promotion? Spending millions of dollars over a tiny slice of aluminium doesn't make sense financially and I really doubt someone is going to undermine the American economy by forging fake pennies. Other than collectors, nobody wants the things to begin with.

 

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Since Lawrence was the Assistant Superintendent, what if the US Mint Superintendent gave him the coin as a retirement gift? Would that "superintendant" not represent the "US Government"?

Here, let's look at a precedent set by the US Government:

"The Toven cent
The Toven aluminum cent, which surfaced in 2005, was graded and encapsulated About Uncirculated 58 by Independent Coin Grading. The cent was subsequently graded MS-62 by PCGS.
Toven was a U.S. Capitol police officer who reportedly picked up the 1974 aluminum cent in the basement of the Rayburn Office Building, after a congressman dropped the coin. Toven tried to return the piece, thinking it was a dime, but he was told to keep it.
Upon closer examination, Toven realized it was not a dime, but one of the experimental cents. Toven kept the piece until he died, in 1999. The Toven 1974 aluminum cent is still owned by the Toven family.
The U.S. Mint has never made any effort to seek the return of the Toven coin."

And. as Armen Vartian argues, folks had better PRAY that the government doesn't get this one back or else, by legal precedent, they could come after EVERYTHING including "error coins" which, technically, should have never left the US Mint.

 

No there isn't Stach. The one the Smithsonian has is a Philly cent, not a Denver Cent.

 

All it takes is one medoraman. Just one to set the precedent that its ok to privately own.

 

Since it is supposedly illegal to mutilate reeded coins, wouldn't it be fair to say that the US Government has never given up "ownership" of any US Coin?

My vote is in the pattern arena and I think it'll pass muster unless specific documentation can be located indicating that the coin is illegal to own. Simply saying so, just doesn't seem to be good enough. They need to "prove" it.

How often have folks been told at the US Post Office by a "government representative" that it is "illegal" to send coins in the mail?

Technically, the coin does not exist since there is 0 US Mint Documentation that the coin(s) were ever struck in Denver. Philadelphia Yes, Denver No.

 

I just learned something new, didn't know that, isn't there a bronze cent too, for that year

 

I have my 2007 red book out, and it was a bronze-clad steel

 

Well first, a mutilated reeded edge coin is not the same as a mint error, since a mint error is as struck, there for by definition not mutilated.

Second, errors are sold in coin bags to the general public. Unless someone proves this trial piece somehow got sold in a mint bag, the mint does not need to prove they didn't sell it, since they are the original title owners. It is legally up to the holder of the coin to prove he has good title, something I do not believe is possible based upon what I have heard.

 

It isn't illegal to mutilate a reeded edge coin, you can mutilate it to your hearts content. What is illegal is to do so with fraudulent intent. The mutilation isn't illegal, the intent to commit fraud is.

The problem with the 1974 D aluminum cent is that the government never made any. This means that technically the crime involved is conversion of government property for private gain. Since the Denver mint never used or had aluminum planchets of that size it must have been brought in from outside and the government dies and presses were used without authorization

 

Show me the "title" for that quarter in your pocket.

And mint errors are not supposed to leave the mint which is why they have processes screening for them. Why, they even have a bounty on the head of any coin rolling company which rolls coins for the US Mint prior to deliver to the Federal Reserve Banks which fails to return the error coins back to the US Mint!

 

Kinda like the 1913 Nickels??

 

On july 24, 2014, judge sides with us mint, http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/jul/23/federal-lawsuit-dismissed-rare-aluminum-coin/ 30 days and counting, for appeal,its all over now, coin will soon be back in the government hands. it will be very hard to get judges order overturned

 

Been looking for info. on appeal, haven't found anything yet, if anybody finds out anything else on the appeal, please post it

 

"Title" in the legal sense means proof of ownership. It does not mean the same as people think of, like a car title piece of paper. Title for quarters leaves the government when they sell the bags of quarters to the Fed. We KNOW many, many 1933 eagles left the mint illegally, but they are legal to own since its also been proven SOME eagles left legally, so therefor its impossible to prove any particular eagle is illegal. However, a 1964 silver dollar never legally left the mint, so all are illegal to own. Same with these cents. If ONE left US ownership legally, then ALL could theoretically be legal to own, since you couldn't prove which one. This is why the mint in the 70's immediately stated none had ever legally been sold, so ALL of them are illegal.

 

thanks, I didn't even see that

 

All thoses 2 did is amend the complaint, what else could they add, to me, its a last ditch effect to prove their case, their wasting their time, complaint was dismissed, for lack of merit, which means, they have no case, to prove their claim

 

Yes only the 1913 nickels are even worse. in that case they not only used government presses and dies but they also used government owned planchets as well. So the 1913 nickel is not only conversion it is also theft of government property.

 

thoses 2 guys, most of hired the stupids lawyer in the country, amend the summons & complaint, STUPID FOOLs

 

It is interesting how they pick and choose which coins to fight over. It seems to me that the 1913 nickels are far worse than the 1974-D cent.