Featured Medieval - The Grosso and the Fourth Crusade

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by FitzNigel, Oct 21, 2016.

  1. stevex6

    stevex6 Random Mayhem

    Atta-boy => well deserved, Fitz


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  3. panzerman

    panzerman Well-Known Member

    Fantastic piece of history. great coins...FitzNigel/Steve/Doug
    Thanks for sharing....
    stevex6 and FitzNigel like this.
  4. Deacon Ray

    Deacon Ray Ya'akov Meshorer fan Supporter

    Thank you, Steve!!! That's the most entertaining video I've seen in ages!!! :) LOL!!
    stevex6 likes this.
  5. TJC

    TJC Well-Known Member

    Great coin and write up!!
    FitzNigel likes this.
  6. TIF

    TIF I am not an expert Supporter

    chrsmat71, FitzNigel and stevex6 like this.
  7. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist Supporter

    And this is why I love the internet...
    TypeCoin971793 and TIF like this.
  8. physics-fan3.14

    physics-fan3.14 Senior Member

    Having a "featured post" is pretty much the highest honor on this site, so congratulations! Good job!
    FitzNigel likes this.
  9. Onofrio Bacigalupo

    Onofrio Bacigalupo Well-Known Member

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  10. seth77

    seth77 Well-Known Member

    Enrico Dandolo also took part in the ill-fated campaign of emperor Baldwin I at Adrianople in April 1205, despite his old age and infirmity. Geoffrey de Villehardouin, which chronicled the establishment of the Latin Empire of Constantinople, lauds his prowess as both councilor and warrior alike.
    After the defeat of Baldwin and Count Louis de Blois's knights by the vastly superior army of Kaloyan, the Czar of the Vlachs and Bulgarians, and the capture of the first and death on the battlefield of the later, Doge Dandolo leads the vanguard of the remaining crusader army while Villehardouin guards its rear for the whole distance between Adrianople and Pamphyla, where the knights Peter Bracieux and Payen d'Orleans add their support to the rearguard all the way back to Rodosto.

    Geoffrey de Villehardouin has this to say of him:

    Then did Geoffrey of Villehardouin, the Marshal of Champagne and Romania, summon to the camp the Doge of Venice, who was an old man and saw naught, but very wise and brave and vigorous; and he asked the Doge to come to him there where he stood with his men, holding the field; and the Doge did so. And when the Marshal saw him, he called him into council, aside, all alone, and said to him: "Lord, you see the misadventure that has befallen us. We have lost the Emperor Baldwin and Count Louis, and the larger part of our people, and of the best. Now let us bethink ourselves how to save what is left. For if God does not take pity of them, we are but lost."

    And in the end they settled it thus: that the Doge would return to the camp, and put heart into the people, and order that every one should arm and remain quiet in his tent or pavilion; and that Geoffrey the Marshal would remain in full order of battle before the camp till it was night, so that their enemies might not see the host move; and that when it was night all would move from before the city; the Doge of Venice would go before, and Geoffrey the Marshal would form the rear-guard, with those who were with him.

    - Geoffrey de Villehardouin, De la Conquete de Constantinople, Defeat of the crusaders, Baldwin is taken, 95-96

    At Rodosto they met with Henry of Hainaut, emperor Baldwin's brother and next in line for the imperial title and they marched together back to Constantinople, saving the remaining crusader army from total annihilation in Thrace.
    Soon after the arrival, Doge Dandolo overwhelmed with old age and exhaustion died in May 1205 and was interred in the Aya Sophia.

    I've written a series of 5 articles about historical and economic aspects of the Latin Empire with parallels to the evolution of small coinage between 1204 and 1261, you can read them here.
    J.A.K., Pellinore, FitzNigel and 2 others like this.
  11. Johndoe2000$

    Johndoe2000$ RE-MEMBER

    Very nice, if only you could provide a little information with your post.(LOL) Great post, very informative.

    stevex6 likes this.
  12. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist Supporter

    Very nice Seth! I had read Villehardouin maybe 15 years ago, and did consult it briefly when putting my account together, but I didn't spend much time with him when I couldn't find anything on Pietro Ziani. Thanks fir the link to the blog too!
  13. Magnus Maximus

    Magnus Maximus Dulce et Decorum est....

    Bloody crusades!:mad::shifty:
    Nice write up Fitz!
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  14. chrsmat71

    chrsmat71 I LIKE TURTLES! Supporter

    oh wow, that was fantastic FN! here's a related coin type that hasn't been posted yet...not a looker, but interesting....


    Latin Empire of Constantinople. A.D. 1204-1261.

    small module trachy (21 mm, 1.8 g). Christ standing facing / Emperor standing facing with labarum and orb. SB 2035. Constantinople.
    De Orc, Ajax, dlhill132 and 4 others like this.
  15. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & odd Moderator

    Great medieval coin!

    Those are a very cool type.

    I had one, not long ago:


    I no longer have that Venetian above, but I do currently have this ca. 1372-1438 Ragusa grosso with Christ and St. Blasius. It too just made XF40 at PCGS.

    (I affectionately call this one my "Hippie Coin", since St. Blasius looks rather like Tommy Chong flashing the peace sign.)

    Curtisimo, Orfew, De Orc and 11 others like this.
  16. chrsmat71

    chrsmat71 I LIKE TURTLES! Supporter

    far out man!
  17. Collect89

    Collect89 Coin Collector

    Thank you for posting this well written and informative thread! It was a real pleasure to read. Here’s an example from my collection.

    Silver Grosso (A.D. 1275-1280)
    Obv: Jesus Christ seated on a throne
    Rev: the 47th Doge of Venice (Jacopo Contarini) on the left receiving a tall flag from the Venetian city’s Saint Mark on the right.

    Jacopo Contarini was the 47th Doge of Venice, from 1275 until his abdication in 1280. The last Doge of Venice was Ludovico Manin, who abdicated in 1797 when Napoleon came to town.
  18. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist Supporter

    Very nice @Collect89 ! The 'X' on your reverse is interesting. Do you know if the rest of the grossos from Jacobo Contarini have this diamond style? Maybe it's some kind of privy mark...
  19. De Orc

    De Orc Well-Known Member

    A very good write up on both the history of the coin and the times it was minted in, love the pics of all the coins shown as well. One other little fact about the horses, they have collars on. These were added after they got to Venice as the heads had to be removed for shipping LOL
    chrisild and FitzNigel like this.
  20. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist Supporter

    I did not know that! Thanks De Orc!
  21. Loong Siew

    Loong Siew Well-Known Member

    Very beautiful coin and an excellent write up
    FitzNigel likes this.
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