I thought I'd post this prior to arranging todays holiday events.... I stumbled upon this example while browsing e-Bay and as the sellers photos indicate, it was from HHC, a reputable seller. Bronzes of this type can be a bit pricey in the more preferred grades and I had to let a few go by over the last several months---and other 'budget' varieties were far too worn and corroded for my taste(s). I think this dupondius may be a slight 'coup' or simply worth what I paid for in the condition it is in---although, I think some gentle careful cleaning might greatly enhance the appeal and better reveal the details. I was winning this coin at less than $40.00 until literally in the last few seconds a 'snip bid' jumped it up to $81.00 shipped. I'd appreciate any comments whether to attempt cleaning it or not and whether it appears this coin was worth the final cost. Apparently, the green splotches are NOT indicative of bronze disease, according to HHC..... Dupondius of Livia/Justitia, under Tiberius, AD 22/23, 14.55 grams Diademed bust, with JVSTITIA below S C in center, TI CAESAR DIVI F AVG PM POT XXIIII RIC 46, BMC 79 HAPPY THANGSGIVING!!!!!!!!
Shes gets expensive no matter what. My little bronze here was a bit more then you paid for your big. Im surprised yours went for that much though due to pits, but at least they're deeper on the reverse. Livia (30 B.C. - 29 A.D) IONIA, Ephesos Grammateus Aristeas, magistrate Æ 16 O: Draped bust right. R: EFE ARCIEREYS ASKLAS EYFRWN, Stag standing right, quiver above. 3.8g 16mm RPC 2580
Wait for more experienced opinions, but I don't think that's going to clean much further. I would however keep it on BD watch for some time. It's an interesting issue and not all that common. If I wanted one of these and had a budget under $100, I still might have passed on this one, though my wait for an acceptable piece within budget may have continued for a good long while.
Um, well...I love you Mikey, you know that, buuuut...I suppose if you absolutely MUST have a Livia then each to his own. I don't think cleaning will help - certainly not the corrosion, and I don't think it's worth the price at all, not even close.
Livia was one cool woman in I Claudius. I know, just a show, but it made me appreciate more the real Livia.
Interesting comments!! Especially since they mirror my own when i first saw this coin. I thought it might be worth about $40.00 in the condition it was in, and thought I put a max of that amount on bid----apparently I placed $80.00 since I still won it when it suddenly jumped to over $78.00 Well, I can always return it if I feel it is as poor a coin as it seems to be---especially if it does have bronze disease too. Amazing how I can rationalize a coins condition LOL
Well I do it all the time with the Arabian/Levantine stuff I collect. So I hope you don't take my comment as a negative judgment. But as far as collecting Livia goes, I believe the better strategy is to simply accept the fact that she's expensive, and cough up the dough for a problem-free coin.
She is, I got mine from my favorite online dealer and it was sheer luck he had one. But she is pricey anyway you look at it. $40-$50 would have been a OK price for the OP coin, $80+ is a bit much but if you're happy with it when it arrives, then thats all that matter. Problem free with decent portraits are about $150+ unless you find a provincial somewhere.
My Livia from Colonia Romula: It's an Augustus / Livia issue under Tiberius. Interestingly Livia is honoured as "mother of the world" in the legend: IVLIA AVGVSTA GENETRIX ORBIS
I'm pretty sure it would sell on vcoins for that amount. Actually, I just looked. There are horrible Livia coins on vcoins going for WAY more than that!
A bit pricey ? Well, probably, but what the heck ! you got a Livia middle bronze that I've been unable to purchase in 35 years of roman coins collecting. The portrait is decent (everyone here could recognize her at first glance) and 80 bucks is just what it is. As long as your family will not be eating potatoes for a month because of that a 2000 year old Livia dupondius vs pocket change, I would have chosen the first In one month or so from now you will have forgotten what it set you back, but not buying it, you would have regrets for years Q PS : I wouldn't clean it more
Thanks everyone for your comments. I greatly appreciate them!!! Greg and 'Q' bring up an interesting point---and that is the relative scarcity of the coin. Although I haven't been actively searching for a Livia portrait, I can't remember the last time I saw one at any of the auctions I routinely browse through. Most that I have seen, especially when I WAS searching for one month earlier this year, were over $100.00 and of lesser or equal 'quality' to the one I posted and most that were about VF -EF were in the $200-$300+ price range. Anyway, while I still believe the coin is about a $50.00 value for the type and grade, I'm hoping it will look better in hand than in the sellers photos---as they so often are. And, I will only boil the coin and 'clean' it with a soft rag or toothbrush and then see what I have---no picking at the coin or otherwise harshly cleaning it. I'll post a before and after if there is any significant difference. Thanks again guys!! And I hope everyone had a terrific Thanksgiving!!!
