I thought I'd create a generic thread to post my numerous lion daalders and other Dutch crowns and minors collected over the past four decades. I also hope that this thread creates a venue for other CT members to post their daalders, silver riders and other denominations. If there is a current thread devoted to this coinage, I apologize. Please let me know. This lion daalder is from Friesland, a mint notable for creating some the crudest lion daalders throughout its years of operation. This coin was minted in 1600, at a time when the old obverse legend of the previous century was still being used, and the date placed at the bottom, separated by the bottom of the shield. As a rule of thumb, Friesland lion daalders from 1606 to 1617 are most readily available, according to my old copy of the Davenport catalog, published by Krause in 1981. Dav. 8815 27.2 grams This coin was acquired from Ritter, through VCoins, back around 2015. It has the typical hammer striking characteristic of these coins, with areas of weakness on a somewhat irregular flan. The result is that the 1 in the date is not visible, and the last 0 is flawed, probably an engraving issue. As with the Spanish mints, the speed and quantity of coinage produced was of paramount importance. I light of this priority, this coin is quite nice overall.
I only have 1 Lion Daalder 1638 But I just recently made this acquisition. 1775 Silver Rider Utrecht Ducaton
Nice coins! The lion daalder is from West Friesland, and I think the date is 1639, but that could be an 8. That's a super nice ducaton!
The obverse has been wiped at some point. There are some visible hairlines under magnification, thus it is an NGC details holder. The reverse is perfect to my eyes. I had to pay for it but it was one of those coins that I fell in love with when I saw it.
Nice lion daalders and ducaton! That half lion daalder is a lot scarcer than the lion daalder. It seems that the Dutch were in a situation similar to the Spanish regarding coin production: it is more efficient to mint more large crown size coin than it is to produce smaller denominations. Rapid production was the rule during the period for these coins. That is an impressive coin! The strike is much better than is typically encountered. The centering is excellent as well. Your ducaton is also very nice. I think it came from the t'Viegent Hart (Flying Heart), an East Indiaman that sank off the coast of Zeeland in 1734. Several boxes of ducatons were recovered. Apparently they were being smuggled and were therefore contraband. Prior to the discovery of these coins, the ducatons of the recovered dates were very scarce. Now, nice examples are available, but ducatons with minimal or no corrosion do bring a premium.
I've got to go through my boxes and pull out some ducatons. They are wonderful coins to handle, given their size and design. I did photograph a couple more lion daalders today. The first one, from Friesland, is more typical of coins from this mint than the OP coin. This is a rough coin, in terms of surfaces (been around the block a few times), flan flaws and crude strike. The date (1)625, on the reverse, is a rarer date for this mint. The design of the legends is also different, compared to the OP coin, which has the format of lion daalder going back to 1575. The obverse reads "Coin Silver of the Province of the Confederation Belgium - Friesland". This format with variations for city issues stayed unchanged for the duration of lion daalder production. The reverse legend remains the same at that of the OP coin, "Confidence in the Lord is not move". Additionally, the date, which used to be on the obverse, is now on the reverse, at around 12 o'clock. There are dates in the 17th century for the city of Zwolle were the date appears on the reverse, in the field, separated in half by the rampant lion. Dav. 8815 27.12 grams The second coin is from 1652, city of Campen. The weight of the coin is 24.86 grams, well below the 27 grams normally expected. I think it is legit. It appears to have been struck on a thinner broad flan (43mm), possibly with lower grade silver. There is one test scratch on the reverse, to the lion's right. Given the relatively low silver content of these coins, at round .750, I have encountered low weight, official coins in the past. It seems that the officials in some mints were not above playing around with a coin's fineness and weight, much as what happened in colonial Spain, at the Potosi mint in the first half of the 17th century, where 8 reales cobs were systematically debased by assayers and other mint officials. That practice ended with the trial and execution of one assayer in 1649. Dav. 4879 What do you think?
Prior to the minting of milled ducatons, the Netherlands produced hammered ducatons, starting in 1659. These coins share the same general design features as the later machine struck ducatons. However, due to the hammer striking process, the quality of these coins can vary widely. On the other hand the dies and the hammer striking give these coins very distinct, often rugged, qualities, which I find very appealing. Because of the striking process, no two coins are exactly identical. This broad (45 mm) ducaton is from the province of Zeeland. Minted in 1662, when the Netherlands was in a period of peace between wars, this coin displays the typical traits of a large hammer struck coin, with areas of weakness along with good detail. Well struck examples tend to be exception, and like the lion daalders, fully struck, well centered coins command a premium. Dav. 4942 32.15 grams The second coin is from a period of what must have been one of high production of lion daalders, from around the mid 1630s to around 1655. This coin, from Campen, dated 1648, the year that marked the end of the devastating Thirty Years War, is a high grade example. Lion daalders from this year through early 1650s appear on the market frequently, and they do present collectors with a chance to buy an example at fairly reasonable prices. Yesterday I posted a coin from Campen, 1652, that weighs 24.86 grams. This coin, minted four years prior, weighs 27.66 grams, which shows how variable these coins can be in terms of weight. Dav. 4879
i haven't bought any of these coins for years. now your making me want to find some more. thats an interesting piece looking left.
Yes, it is a very distinctive type that Campen produced for two years, 1648 and 1649, before reverting back to the traditional knight facing right. The various mints over the course of minting lion daalders did, from time to time create some interesting varieties. Utrecht, in 1680 produced a lion daalder that has no inner border for the legend on both sides. It is quite scarce. This is an example that has obvious circulation, along the quirky, uneven strike typical of these coins along with poor flan preparation. I am not sure whether the absence of the inner border was intentional or a mistake by the engraver. Dav. 4865 26.45 grams
I have only one Netherlands Lion Dollar froum Utrecht: Netherlands Lion dollar (Leeuwendaalder) Utrecht 1608 Silver, 41 mm, 26.98 gm Obverse: Standing knight with shield in front, lion on shield MO ARG PRO CONFOE BELG TRA (Moneta Argentea Provinciarum Confoederatum Belgicarum Traiectum) (Silver money of the Province of the Netherlands Confederation at Traiectum) Belgium was an old Latin name for all Netherlands or Low Countries and Traiectum was an old Latin name for Utrecht. Reverse: Lion facing left CONFIDENS DNO NON MOVETVR (Confidens Domino Non Movetur) (Confidence in the Lord is not moved)
That's a very nice example! You might have an overdate (8/7), but I can't say for sure, given the image. I think I see the bottom of the 7 protruding from the bottom of the 8. Krause does list an overdate for 1608, Utrecht.
Here's another coin that I photographed today, a necessity or emergency daalder of Campen, 1672. This coin was issued following the siege of the city by the forces of the Archbishop of Munster, during the war between the United Provinces and France. This coin was purchased from a World Wide Coins of California auction in 1991. Dave 4987
The coin I'm posting today is a fake, a contemporary fake, likely of Asian origins (Indonesia?), of a ducaton, Holland, 1776. This coin came to me by way of Karl Stephens, who I highly recommend for world coins and medals. It weighs 33.20 grams, somewhat over the 32.779 grams standard for this type. Stylistically this coin is a very good imitation of the original design. The lions are "chunky" with smiling faces. The legends, though, are garbled, especially on the reverse, where there is are a retrograde D and C for good measure. In terms of the surfaces, well, the signs of a fake are quite obvious, with patchy toning where the silver plating is thin, allowing the core metal to leach out, toning-wise. There are also the typical breaks in spots, notably on the rider and horse, where the metal core shows through. This is a very interesting coin, a contemporary fake of an important trade coin for Indonesia (Java) and other parts of Asia. Here's a view of the coin's edge:
