Log in or Sign up
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Coin Chat
>
Lets talk about my Peace Dollar
>
Reply to Thread
Message:
<p>[QUOTE="GDJMSP, post: 1652836, member: 112"]No, it doesn't happen, because it is impossible for it to happen. </p><p><br /></p><p>What does happen however is that people will mistakenly call some lines on a coin die polish lines when they are not die polish lines at all. This occurs because many people do not understand how dies are polished, the don't understand the method used to polish them. And unless you understand that then you cannot understand the very nature of die polish lines.</p><p><br /></p><p>First of all, picture a die for a dollar. The surface of the die is about 1 1/2 inches across, 38mm. It is basically flat, but there are recesses in the die that form the letters, numbers, and devices. These recesses are a good bit lower than the surface of the die, which forms the fields. So if you took something else that is metal like the die is, and it was flat like the die is, and you pressed those objects together so that they touched face to face all the way across, then it is impossible for the surface of the other metal object to touch any part or the die except the highest parts of the die - the fields. The recesses in the die, the letters, numbers, and devices cannot be touched, at all, by this other metal object. It is impossible and cannot be done. With me so far ?</p><p><br /></p><p>Now this other metal object I am talking about is a round zinc plate, much like a dinner plate only perfectly flat. That is what is used to polish dies. They have used this method since the early days of the mint. The zinc plate has a hole in the center so it can be attached to a spindle, a machine. The machine spins the zinc plate at a high rate. The surface of the zinc plate is impregnated with diamond dust. The dust comes in varying degrees of fineness, it can be course or very fine, or anywhere in between. It is the zinc plate, along with the diamond dust that does the polishing. And the finer the dust the higher the degree of polish.</p><p><br /></p><p>Now when a die needs polished the die is attached to a press, kind of like a drill press. The die is locked into a chuck so that it is held perfectly flat and parallel to the surface of the zinc plate. The two are then pressed together with the die being held motionless, the zinc plate spins and polishes the surface, the fields, of the die. It is this spinning and polishing that leaves behind fine lines in the fields of the die. If the diamond dust was course then the lines are course. If the dust was fine then the lines are fine. And it is impossible for the surface of the zinc plate to touch any part of the recesses in the die. So there can be no die polish lines on the letters, numbers, or devices of the die.</p><p><br /></p><p>Now another part of this is pure mathematics. That being that a round object has a given arc. And the larger the diameter of the object, the larger the arc is. But even an arc can appear to be a straight, or nearly straight, line if the arc is big enough, or if you only observe a small portion of that arc. That is just plain geometry - a fact.</p><p><br /></p><p>Now on a coin die polish lines appear to be straight, or nearly straight lines. That is because when we see them we are only looking at small portions of the original arc. Remember the coin is only 1 1/2 inches across, pretty small to begin with. And usually the lines we see only cover a small portion of that 1 1/2 inches, so the die polish lines are only a fraction of an inch long.</p><p><br /></p><p>Now we go back to the plate. The coin die is about 1 1/2 inches across. The plate is say 10 to 12 inches across. The die is held stationary, locked in place, it is not moved around. The plate is held stationary too, locked in place but spinning. And where the die and the plate touch, the die is only touching a small portion of that plate. Visualize an object 1 1/2 inches across held against an object 12 inches across and you begin to get the idea. The larger spinning plate crates fine lines on the surface of the die as it polishes the die. But the portions of the arc of the 12 inch plate are but a fraction of an inch on the die because of the size differential. So when we look at the lines on a finished coin the lines appear to be straight, or very nearly so. The lines are also parallel to each other. And they cannot criss-cross each other because of their very nature, they have to be parallel. The mathematics, the geometry, says so.</p><p><br /></p><p>Once you have all of this in your mind you have to remember something else. There are other things that can cause or create fine lines in the surface of a die - besides die polishing. Those lines can be created by a worker wiping a rag across the surface of a die to remove dirt or grease. The grit in the dirt or grease, as well as the rag itself, is abrasive and when the rag wipes them off the die, those abrasives can lightly scratch the die. Lines can also be caused/created on a die with small hand tools used by a worker when working on the die. </p><p><br /></p><p>Both of these types of lines or fine scratches can occur on the fields, or in the devices of the die. And both result in raised lines on the finished coin. But since neither one of them is caused by die polishing, they <u>are not die polish lines</u>. And that is where the mistake comes. People call them die polish lines, when in fact they nothing but die scratch lines. There is a difference, a distinct difference, between die polish lines and die scratch lines on a finished coin.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="GDJMSP, post: 1652836, member: 112"]No, it doesn't happen, because it is impossible for it to happen. What does happen however is that people will mistakenly call some lines on a coin die polish lines when they are not die polish lines at all. This occurs because many people do not understand how dies are polished, the don't understand the method used to polish them. And unless you understand that then you cannot understand the very nature of die polish lines. First of all, picture a die for a dollar. The surface of the die is about 1 1/2 inches across, 38mm. It is basically flat, but there are recesses in the die that form the letters, numbers, and devices. These recesses are a good bit lower than the surface of the die, which forms the fields. So if you took something else that is metal like the die is, and it was flat like the die is, and you pressed those objects together so that they touched face to face all the way across, then it is impossible for the surface of the other metal object to touch any part or the die except the highest parts of the die - the fields. The recesses in the die, the letters, numbers, and devices cannot be touched, at all, by this other metal object. It is impossible and cannot be done. With me so far ? Now this other metal object I am talking about is a round zinc plate, much like a dinner plate only perfectly flat. That is what is used to polish dies. They have used this method since the early days of the mint. The zinc plate has a hole in the center so it can be attached to a spindle, a machine. The machine spins the zinc plate at a high rate. The surface of the zinc plate is impregnated with diamond dust. The dust comes in varying degrees of fineness, it can be course or very fine, or anywhere in between. It is the zinc plate, along with the diamond dust that does the polishing. And the finer the dust the higher the degree of polish. Now when a die needs polished the die is attached to a press, kind of like a drill press. The die is locked into a chuck so that it is held perfectly flat and parallel to the surface of the zinc plate. The two are then pressed together with the die being held motionless, the zinc plate spins and polishes the surface, the fields, of the die. It is this spinning and polishing that leaves behind fine lines in the fields of the die. If the diamond dust was course then the lines are course. If the dust was fine then the lines are fine. And it is impossible for the surface of the zinc plate to touch any part of the recesses in the die. So there can be no die polish lines on the letters, numbers, or devices of the die. Now another part of this is pure mathematics. That being that a round object has a given arc. And the larger the diameter of the object, the larger the arc is. But even an arc can appear to be a straight, or nearly straight, line if the arc is big enough, or if you only observe a small portion of that arc. That is just plain geometry - a fact. Now on a coin die polish lines appear to be straight, or nearly straight lines. That is because when we see them we are only looking at small portions of the original arc. Remember the coin is only 1 1/2 inches across, pretty small to begin with. And usually the lines we see only cover a small portion of that 1 1/2 inches, so the die polish lines are only a fraction of an inch long. Now we go back to the plate. The coin die is about 1 1/2 inches across. The plate is say 10 to 12 inches across. The die is held stationary, locked in place, it is not moved around. The plate is held stationary too, locked in place but spinning. And where the die and the plate touch, the die is only touching a small portion of that plate. Visualize an object 1 1/2 inches across held against an object 12 inches across and you begin to get the idea. The larger spinning plate crates fine lines on the surface of the die as it polishes the die. But the portions of the arc of the 12 inch plate are but a fraction of an inch on the die because of the size differential. So when we look at the lines on a finished coin the lines appear to be straight, or very nearly so. The lines are also parallel to each other. And they cannot criss-cross each other because of their very nature, they have to be parallel. The mathematics, the geometry, says so. Once you have all of this in your mind you have to remember something else. There are other things that can cause or create fine lines in the surface of a die - besides die polishing. Those lines can be created by a worker wiping a rag across the surface of a die to remove dirt or grease. The grit in the dirt or grease, as well as the rag itself, is abrasive and when the rag wipes them off the die, those abrasives can lightly scratch the die. Lines can also be caused/created on a die with small hand tools used by a worker when working on the die. Both of these types of lines or fine scratches can occur on the fields, or in the devices of the die. And both result in raised lines on the finished coin. But since neither one of them is caused by die polishing, they [U]are not die polish lines[/U]. And that is where the mistake comes. People call them die polish lines, when in fact they nothing but die scratch lines. There is a difference, a distinct difference, between die polish lines and die scratch lines on a finished coin.[/QUOTE]
Your name or email address:
Do you already have an account?
No, create an account now.
Yes, my password is:
Forgot your password?
Stay logged in
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Coin Chat
>
Lets talk about my Peace Dollar
>
Home
Home
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Activity
Recent Posts
Forums
Forums
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Posts
Competitions
Competitions
Quick Links
Competition Index
Rules, Terms & Conditions
Gallery
Gallery
Quick Links
Search Media
New Media
Showcase
Showcase
Quick Links
Search Items
Most Active Members
New Items
Directory
Directory
Quick Links
Directory Home
New Listings
Members
Members
Quick Links
Notable Members
Current Visitors
Recent Activity
New Profile Posts
Sponsors
Menu
Search
Search titles only
Posted by Member:
Separate names with a comma.
Newer Than:
Search this thread only
Search this forum only
Display results as threads
Useful Searches
Recent Posts
More...