Krause catalog world coin values

Would like to challange the use of the Krause coin catalog and all "updated versions" 1. values stipulated and 2. better than online catalogs for mintages and pictures and so on..? Look at examples below, then take a person that inherited a collection going to a coin dealer for example? How many people gets nailed by this? Below are few examples (the list is long) of South African coins sold at auction and what they are/were valued by Krause catalog. Would like to hear your opinion.


SA 1926 Florin
SOLD 12,650.00 US (Apr 16, 2011)
Krause 650 US UNC
http://coins.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleNo=3014&lotNo=24867

ZAR 1892 proof penny
SOLD 195,500.00 US (Sep 9, 2011)
Krause 60 US UNC!!
http://coins.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleNo=3015&lotNo=25659

SA Farthing 1930
SOLD 5,750.00 US (Sep 19, 2008)
Krause 200 US UNC
http://coins.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleNo=3002&lotNo=22465

ZAR 1892 5 Shilling proof
SOLD 161,000.00 US (Jan 3, 2012)
Krause 2,000 UNC
http://coins.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleNo=3016&lotNo=25061

 

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Maybe I am just slow, but never realised that it was so bad, 161,000 vs. 60 US!!!! It takes some time to understand the hobby such that you can make a good call on value. What about new people to the hobby? I think that almost all South African (country that I know) coins are are undervalued. This is not good for foreign coin hobbby since there is no accurate base guide. How much trouble can it be to include new prices or "notes for that matter" in the updated versions. If you do not do that, do not include the prices or do not bring out a new version.

 

I'm certainly no expert, still being kind of new on the coin collecting continuum (I've been at it seriously for about two years now), but I have learned to tell from observing auctions that some countries are consistently overvalued and others are undervalued. I know some people don't like to use eBay as a guide, but the way I see it, it is a good range of value, because when I go to a dealer and see a coin for sale, I want to know if I can get it for less on eBay or if the dealer has it priced for less than I've seen it selling for. Most often I feel like I see dealers price coins according to the price guide, whereas I know they are selling for much less online. This is why you really need to know what the market is like for a given coin. Of course the examples you give are for very special coins and most of what I buy is on the cheap side, but it still applies even so.

 

Derick, I too find Krause almost worthless when it comes to being useful as a 'price guide'. This certainly applies for
the series that I am interested in.

If I want to find out the approximate value of a non-U.S coin, what I use is:

www.mcsearch.info
www.acsearch.info

These sites contain invaluable actual auction prices realized information (going back a few years) for World coins, and Ancient coins respectively.

 

That is great information thank you. Something positive, my union of SA coins are worth more than what I thought. Negative, my wife bought me the new Krause 2013 for Christmas.

 

Like Doug said, the Krause catalog has been known for under or over valuing coins. Not only that many of the info. listed in them such as mintage numbers are wrong. To me, the Krause catalog is good for identifying coins that uses eastern written languages on them, and its good as a mini checklist.

 

Ah well, but at least it has some nice pictures in it.

MC Search is valuable for world coins because it consolidates auction results for at least 30 major Auction Houses, many of them European and also some in Asia.
Used together with auction archives from Heritage and Stack/Bowers you get a good balance of values for say your S.A coins.

 

Personally, I find the Krause books useful in the intitial identification of a coin beyond that there are some issues regarding how they're organized (ie: NCLTs, regular issues, unusual coins, tokens, etc.).

Price wise they reflect what was popular in 60's, 70's and 80's. What I find offensive is those folks who have lots of money to burn and send prices skyrocketing out of the reach of most collectors. Even some modest coins have gone beyond my budget due to the new collectors from India, China, the Middle East, and the US. Some of these collectors are used to paying too much for coins because they started off collecting NCLTs or popular so-called "rare" or "scarce" coins which are almost always waaayyy over priced. So in turn they bring that, "paying whatever price" out of ignorance with them to the online auctions.

 

I was at a coin shop yesterday and he was looking up a coin from Panama that I wanted to buy in Krause. Well, whatever edition he had didn't seem to have Panama listed at all. I watched him look and it just wasn't where it should be. He ended up checking an earlier edition. I don't know how they could leave off an entire nation, but it didn't seem to be there.

 

Hidden i have few Krause editions' they always contained Panama may be missing pages'? Also you can access the online listing at their website it has latest prices. I regularly send emails when i notice mistakes' in Krause catalog' and these days they are quick to fix them on their online catalog. Hopefully it makes' it over in their next publication as well. Just be sure to double check any information from Krause before bidding on item, value of lot of items have been downgraded due to mistakes' (gold/silver finesse being the major culprit).

 

Derik, in response to your OP, The SA penny prices was for circulation issues, and the coin they sold was one of only 20 proofs struck. HA messed up and listed prices of a coin that was irrelevant to the coin being sold. Many of the others are high grade MS, and you are comparing them to BU prices. You know as well as I BU can be pretty darn ugly, so you are comparing prices for beat up, scratched ugly BU versus high end pretty examples. Look up the price difference between many morgan dollars in ugly MS60 and high end 64 or 65 prices. That is MAINLY what you are noticing here.

Yes, KM is not always current, but a lot of these coins rarely sell. I would rather them conservative than wildly guessing what something may be worth. Not defending them, but at least the KM catalog told you a scruffy BU is better than average, and that is its job. It cannot tell you how high is high for a superlative coin, since they have no way of knowing.

 

I use NGC but alot of values are pathetically low compared to market value I just tend to look at that and make my own mind up as too how much I want it from there

 

The penny was a wrong example (HA mistake like you said), but is still valued at 4,500 in my Krause. Sometimes it is noted that a specific rare coin sold for an amount at an auction, but notes are very incomplete. It would be usefull to have section within each country listing relevant auction (including rare sales on ebay) data. By doing this the catalogers will start to get a feeling for the other prices they listed in the normal section and over time correct it. My problem is that the new updates in the new additions do not justify buying a newer version. I also feel that the pictures are incomplete and would like to see better qaulity and more pictures on listed varieties.

 

I have never bought new editions of Krause. Like all other price guides, I use it as a rough guide as to what is better or not. "Better" meaning a $100 coin versus a $.50 one. If I see one for sale I research it independently.

I have written before about price guides and why common coins are overpriced and expensive ones underpriced. Just knowing that tidbit of info is very valuable to know, and know you can never trust any price guide on the high end.

 

Krause does US and modern collectors a tremendous disservice. A disproportionate number of world rarities are in the US because our large middle class had more foreign coin collectyors than existed outside the US in the '50's through '70's. Now many valuable coins are being picked up by foreigners in the US and through coins being shipped overseas by other means.

Krause even missed several countries in the newest edition including Spain!!!

Collectors need to be very careful before selling rare or modern world coins.

Some of the most extreme pricing differentials might be in definitions. Grading is often key to value and Krause has extremely high standards in grading. For the main part Unc means MS-63 and chBU means virtually Gem. Proof means red even on very old issues.

 

I believe if you adhered to Krause pricing every time you bought a coin, and achieved a combination of Heritage and eBay price realized when selling, you would be making money on 60% to 70% of the coins you flipped, and breaking even on 15% to 20% of the remainder. And of course there would be that handful of coins, no matter how well intentioned, that you got absolutely killed on. Still, over time, it would be a very profitable venture. Buy at catalog, sell at price realized. Not a chance anyone would succeed 100% of the time, but if you prevailed more than half the time you would still be making money. Trouble is, most of the coins listed for sale in fixed price lists or raw in dealer inventory typically have some sort of issue. Many coins in slabs have problems too. Uncirculated, BUT with that little rim cut or some other minor problem pulling down the coin's value. The longer I have been at this game, the more I come to appreciate that a problem-free coin is rather the exception than the rule. If you can find a nice attractive UNC with solid collector appeal, priced at below Krause (at one time 20 years ago most dealers sold at 20% UNDER catalog) and without any problems, it's almost a sure thing to make some money on it. Of course there is some economics of scale involved in it as well, --essentially we are talking about coins worth at least $50 or more. For modern stuff in base metal there is no telling what it's really worth, much as a few others have shared.

 

I want to share my experience about krause, they list a 1990 Brandenburg silver proof 20 Mark (east Germany) at 100 dolars, I bought it for 25.

 

I realize this is an old thread, but I use the Standard Catalog of World Coins for organizing coins, metallic content, mintage figures and many of the helpful photos. I do look at their pricing, but usually for proof and mints sets to find out what the original issue price was at the time.

 

Krause is a "good" price guide for those sellers who could care less about the various world coins in their inventory.

Of course, actual experience in buying and selling World Coins will inform you on price better than Krause.

And I do notice errors in Krause, just from my own exploration of S. Korean coins, so if one wants to specialize in a certain World Coin series, try to find sources of information from the country where the coins originate. IF they exist. But you have to find that out(!)