Just got this today. Does this look like a 63?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Morgandude11, May 3, 2012.

Page 5 of 7
  1. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    Hello

    You might be new to how this media works but anyone can post to any thread and nobody owns any threads.

    That is not true. Nobody has attacked you and everyone who posted here gave evidence to support their positions.

    This is not the way to make friends here.

    Amanda
     
    areich, May 6, 2012
    #81 + Quote Reply
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  3. silverspoonvint

    silverspoonvint New Member

    I disagree, this closeup is kinda like my avatar, just taken from an angle. Your photo makes it impossible to tell true luster and contrast. Just my two cents. This is more ideal, taken from coins I've owned in the past:
    DSC02015.jpg DSC02034.jpg DSC02036.jpg DSC02041.jpg DSC02043.jpg
     
    silverspoonvint, May 6, 2012
    #82 + Quote Reply
  4. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    Hello

    How does one use the ignore feature?

    Amanda
     
    areich, May 6, 2012
    #83 + Quote Reply
  5. Morgandude11

    Morgandude11 As long as it's Silver, I'm listening

    Morgan-63o.jpg Morgan-64o.jpg Morgan-65o.jpg

    Left to right: MS 63 MS 64 Ms 65

    According to PCGS Standards---not my rubrics, but from their grading of obverses on Morgans. Notice that even the '65s have a fair amount of contact marks, nicks and spots. They get fewer and fewer as one goes up the grade, but do not disappear until the 66-67 range. So, I think my original premise was pretty correct, if we are using the obverse as the point of discussion. The reverses are similar, and can be posted as well. 63s are as a rule, quite baggy. 64s are still pretty baggy, and 65s exhibit some "noise," just less of it.
     
    Morgandude11, May 6, 2012
    #84 + Quote Reply
  6. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    Hello

    So in your opinion this does not represent a clear photograph of the coin?

    dsc00032.jpg

    That is interesting. As someone who photographs artworks professionally for the purposes of restoration, I professionally say that your straining your credibility on this topic.

    Amanda
     
    areich, May 6, 2012
    #85 + Quote Reply
  7. Morgandude11

    Morgandude11 As long as it's Silver, I'm listening

    A. Not claiming ownership of threads, but I don't post multiple denigrating comments on other folks' posts just to be heard. I am answering you with one post.

    B. Mrbrklyn was very condescending. I was quite humorous in my responses for a while, but it got tiresome, so I responded in kind.

    C. I have attempted to be polite with everybody else--I even acknowledged your very polite and professional response in a post. He blew me off, not vice versa. Yes, I wish to make friends, but am not a sucker for being talked down to, or treated in a hostile manner.
     
    Morgandude11, May 6, 2012
    #86 + Quote Reply
  8. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    Hello

    There seems to be this trend that people keep posting the same photographs over and over as proof of a changed condition. Standardly, grading is done with a 5x loop. I don't think those photos have enough data on them to reach that fidelity. This has become largely a testosterone filled antagonistic contest. This is not an efficient means of spending leisure time and your not really adding to my understanding of coins and grading.

    Amanda
     
    areich, May 6, 2012
    #87 + Quote Reply
  9. silverspoonvint

    silverspoonvint New Member


    Not sure if that was directed at me or not but your pic is clear if one was trying to attribute a VAM or something. As to representing its eye appeal, a key metric in grade, I'm not sure it meets that threshold.
     
    silverspoonvint, May 6, 2012
    #88 + Quote Reply
  10. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    Can you tell em how to use the ignore feature?

    Amanda
     
    areich, May 6, 2012
    #89 + Quote Reply
  11. Morgandude11

    Morgandude11 As long as it's Silver, I'm listening

    Amanda, my post from the PCGS site is an attempt to show what THEY use as rubrics for grading. Those are from their grading standards, and I think they are clear enough to show what THEY use as guidelines for Morgan dollar grade standards. No testosterone intended--just trying to answer various questions raised. Sorry if you felt it was purely a macho thing, but that was not my intent.
     
    Morgandude11, May 6, 2012
    #90 + Quote Reply
  12. mrbrklyn

    mrbrklyn New Member

    • Today 04:01 PM #81
      areich
      [​IMG]
      America*s Darling [​IMG] Join DateApr 2012LocationBrooklyn, NYPosts293Liked75 times

      [​IMG] Originally Posted by Morgandude11 [​IMG]
      This guy, Brooklyn keeps complaining about me and my coin, and keeps posting on MY thread.



      Hello

      You might be new to how this media works but anyone can post to any thread and nobody owns any threads.

      What exactly is his problem, other than lack of knowledge and attitude?


      That is not true. Nobody has attacked you and everyone who posted here gave evidence to support their positions.

      Oh, well, that is why there is an ignore list. Just somebody please explain to me why he has that attitude, as all I did was post a coin that I thought MIGHT have been misgraded. He attacks me personally, attacks my photographs, which were no better nor worse than his, and attacks my coin so vehemently? What did I do--kick his dog or something????


      This is not the way to make friends here.

      Amanda ​






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    • Today, 04:02 PM
      silverspoonvint
      Member

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    • Today 04:05 PM #83
      areich
      [​IMG]
      America*s Darling [​IMG] Join DateApr 2012LocationBrooklyn, NYPosts293Liked75 times

      Hello

      How does one use the ignore feature?

      Amanda ​






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    • Today, 04:08 PM
      Morgandude11
      Senior Member

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    • Today 04:11 PM #85
      areich
      [​IMG]
      America*s Darling [​IMG] Join DateApr 2012LocationBrooklyn, NYPosts293Liked75 times

      Hello

      So in your opinion this does not represent a clear photograph of the coin?

      [​IMG]

      That is interesting. As someone who photographs artworks professionally for the purposes of restoration, I professionally say that your straining your credibility on this topic.

      Amanda ​






      [​IMG] Reply [​IMG] Reply With Quote [​IMG] Blog this Post
    • Today, 04:16 PM
      Morgandude11
      Senior Member

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    • Today 04:16 PM #87
      areich
      [​IMG]
      America*s Darling [​IMG] Join DateApr 2012LocationBrooklyn, NYPosts293Liked75 times

      [​IMG] Originally Posted by Morgandude11 [​IMG]
      Attachment 175914Attachment 175915Attachment 175916

      Left to right: MS 63 MS 64 Ms 65

      According to PCGS Standards---not my rubrics, but from their grading of obverses on Morgans. Notice that even the '65s have a fair amount of contact marks, nicks and spots. They get fewer and fewer as one goes up the grade, but do not disappear until the 66-67 range. So, I think my original premise was pretty correct, if we are using the obverse as the point of discussion. The reverses are similar, and can be posted as well. 63s are as a rule, quite baggy. 64s are still pretty baggy, and 65s exhibit some "noise," just less of it.



      Hello

      There seems to be this trend that people keep posting the same photographs over and over as proof of a changed condition. Standardly, grading is done with a 5x loop. I don't think those photos have enough data on them to reach that fidelity. This has become largely a testosterone filled antagonistic contest. This is not an efficient means of spending leisure time and your not really adding to my understanding of coins and grading.

      Amanda ​






      [​IMG] Reply [​IMG] Reply With Quote [​IMG] Blog this Post
    • Today, 04:18 PM
      silverspoonvint
      Member

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    • Today 04:18 PM #89
      areich
      [​IMG]
      America*s Darling [​IMG] Join DateApr 2012LocationBrooklyn, NYPosts293Liked75 times

      [​IMG] Originally Posted by Morgandude11 [​IMG]
      A. Not claiming ownership of threads, but I don't post multiple denigrating comments on other folks' posts just to be heard. I am answering you with one post.

      B. Mrbrklyn was very condescending. I was quite humorous in my responses for a while, but it got tiresome, so I responded in kind.

      C. I have attempted to be polite with everybody else--I even acknowledged your very polite and professional response in a post. He blew me off, not vice versa. Yes, I wish to make friends, but am not a sucker for being talked down to, or treated in a hostile manner.



      Can you tell em how to use the ignore feature?

      Amanda ​






      [​IMG] Reply [​IMG] Reply With Quote [​IMG] Blog this Post
     
    mrbrklyn, May 6, 2012
    #91 + Quote Reply
  13. mrbrklyn

    mrbrklyn New Member

    It is listed in the profile of the user...
     
    mrbrklyn, May 6, 2012
    #92 + Quote Reply
  14. silverspoonvint

    silverspoonvint New Member

    Folks we only live once, and this is just talk over a hobby, hardly worth ignoring folks or histrionics. I'm sure the OP from Florida and the Brooklyn caucus and come to an understanding that forums are full of misunderstandings. It's all about the love folks.
     
    silverspoonvint, May 6, 2012
    #93 + Quote Reply
  15. Morgandude11

    Morgandude11 As long as it's Silver, I'm listening

    Absolutely, Sliverspoon--If I offended anybody, I apologize. That was not my intent--this is a hobby and it is "the hobby" in my opinion, a lifelong one. I wish I could withdraw this thread, as it has created animosity. I was wrong, and apologize for straining tensions.

    Obviously, this isn't the place for me, as I don't wish to get into arguments regarding coin grading. How does one terminate his/her account?
     
    Morgandude11, May 6, 2012
    #94 + Quote Reply
  16. silverspoonvint

    silverspoonvint New Member

    Somehow I got ignored by the Brooklyn folks as well. I made the mistake of disagreeing over the quality of a close up photo and that was all she wrote. I feel bad that something I did in good faith made him feel as if he had to scrub my thoughts from existence.
     
    silverspoonvint, May 6, 2012
    #95 + Quote Reply
  17. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins

    Rubric......rubric? All I know is Ruprecht.

    [video=youtube;nqMc9B7uDV8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqMc9B7uDV8[/video]
     
    green18, May 6, 2012
    #96 + Quote Reply
  18. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    green ... soon you'll be in the Brooklyn constituency for the geographically challenged..
     
    areich, May 6, 2012
    #97 + Quote Reply
  19. silverspoonvint

    silverspoonvint New Member

    Wouldn't go that far, I think that Mrbrooklyn is a kid, here's his website:http://www.mrbrklyn.com/coins.html . I'd be hard pressed to see someone walk out the door due to just a couple of opinions. He's probably a very smart kid, you and him just didn't mesh right at first, lol.
     
    silverspoonvint, May 6, 2012
    #98 + Quote Reply
  20. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins

    Never could find my way around........
     
    green18, May 6, 2012
    #99 + Quote Reply
  21. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Morgandude -

    I believe there's a couple of reasons for some for some of the responses. 1- some folks just disagree with you. No real biggie there, folks disagree with me all the time around here. 'Course I often disagree with them too. And if everybody agreed with everybody else, it'd be kind of boring.

    2 - Not everybody agrees with the way the TPGs grade coins. There was a time when I would agree with most of their grades, but those days are gone I'm afraid. It is my belief that the TPGs changed their grading standards in 2004, and IMO it's been downhill from there. There are some who agree with me on that, and others who disagree with me on that.

    As for the PCGS pics you posted, I really wish they'd never have done that. I mean, yeah it serves a purpose, but it also does a lot of harm for folks trying to learn how to grade and confuses even more folks. That's because people look at those pictures and then think that any coin that has a similar amount of marks, or a similar amount of luster, or a similar anything should grade the same as what they say those pics do.

    Unfortunately that isn't how it works with grading. Sometimes a coin can have a lot fewer marks than one in those pics, but that doesn't mean it will grade better than the coin in the pics. There could be 4 or 5 other things that hold the grade down, or boost the grade up. Or, a coin in one of those pics may look to have great luster, when it really doesn't. Or it may look to have poor luster, when it really doesn't. And that's where some folks get confused from looking at pics for grade examples.

    Pictures are terrible for people trying to learn how to grade, there is just too much more that goes into it that you can't see in pictures. And sometimes pictures don't show things that you would see if you looked at the coin in hand. And other times pictures do show things that you missed when you looked at it in hand.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is that when you are discussing a coin's grade, and of course a picture is all we have to go by, posting a picture of another graded coin and trying to use that as an indication of the grade of the one you are discussing - well, it quite often doesn't work.

    But anyway, don't get discouraged if folks disagree with you, or disagree about the grade of a coin. It is going to happen. But that's why we're all here, to talk about such things and hopefully learn something. To me the most important thing any of us can do is keep an open mind and try to see things from other's point of view. And if ya disagree then ya disagree. But it's no biggie, it just is.
     
    GDJMSP, May 6, 2012
    #100 + Quote Reply
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