Juno Moneta- Die, Anvil, Tongs, Hammer

My first Denarius, unless someone tells me it's a fake .......

Bought it here
Vcoins


Moneyer issues of Imperatorial Rome. T. Carisius. 46 BC. AR Denarius (18.77mm, 3.92 g, 5h). Rome mint. Head of Juno Moneta right / Implements for coining money: anvil, garlanded cap above, tongs and hammer on either side; all within laurel wreath. References: Craw., 464/2; Bab., 1;


I think others have this one. Yes?

 

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Looks like an OK example, nice grab. Would like one myself.

 

Wowie, that's a very nice example of the type-- a type notoriously poorly executed (ironically so, given the reverse subject matter). Arsantiqva has bunches of coins I'd love to have.

Mine is more typical of the issue, with areas of flatness and generally sloppy workmanship. The portrait is more detailed than many. Too bad I really don't care about this coin's obverse though-- the reverse is the, ahem, money shot


Roman Republic
moneyer T. Carisius, 46 BCE
AR Denarius, 18 mm, 3.62 gm
Obv: head of Juno Moneta right; MONETA behind
Rev: implements for coining money: anvil die with garlanded punch die above; tongs and hammer on either side; T CARISIVS above; all within laurel wreath
Ref: Crawford 464/2; CRI 70; Sydenham 982a; Carisia 1a
ex Andrew McCabe

 

I noticed that coin! That's an exceptional example of a generally poorly produced type, very VERY hard to improve on. Congrats! I especially like the clear and fully struck laurel wreath around the die depicted on the reverse.

 

I don't know what was the price for this particular coin, but all coins that I saw sold by this merchant, have 200%-300% markup

 

Very nice 4to2centBC, one of the better ones I have seen.

 

Markup over what? Do you know what the seller paid for it? If you mean markup over some generic "fair" price, what would you consider fair for this type in this quality?

 

It certainly looks authentic to me and it is a beauty.

My poor mans example

 

Please use acsearch, CNG and other means necessary to determine a true market value. There is nothing generic in this world, everything has price and scale of measurement. Please know that: "Fair market value (FMV) is, in its simplest expression, the price that a person reasonable interested in buying a given asset would pay to a person reasonably interested in selling it for the purchase of the asset or asset would fetch in the marketplace" Key word -marketplace.
Now, it's up to you as educated consumer / collector to either: pay whatever it takes or pay true market value.. Does it make sense now?

 

Yes to all you said but especially this part. It looked too nice for the type, at this price.

Thanks. I could not ask for a better commendation.

btw I was tempted to run it past you first, but i did not want to tap your brain gratis and I was trying to grab it ASAP anyway ( I put it into my cart as soon as I saw it.) I was soooooo tempted to check with you first.

What Phil said below.

I didn't even flinch at the price. I always check comps. I was actually concerned that it was too nice for that low a price....thus I was a bit concerned about authenticity.

 

it was 121%

 

You have an oversimplified view of the coin market IMHO. Auction prices can be quite variable based on quite a few factors, some as seemingly insignificant as time of year of the auction.

 

I noticed the coin for sale too. Had I not over-extended my budget in some recent auctions, I might have beat you to the purchase!

I disagree with one aspect of the description of the coin: I don't believe that's a garlanded reverse die, rather it is a garlanded cap. The cap is an attribute of Vulcan, the god of smiths and metalworkers. Note the roundish top. If it were a die, it'd be awfully difficult to strike with that rounded top!

 

Trust me on this, I know the market value of Roman Republican silver as well as or better than literally anyone else in the world. I was asking YOU what YOU believe the value of this coin to be, since you seem to suspect the seller overcharged for it.

 

Suum cuique

 

I'm not so sure about the accuracy of that presumption.

I can't work out the physics of it, but it would be similar to the effectiveness of this Gerson Hammer (but in reverse-- the die rounded and the hammer traditionally shaped):

 

It's described variously, but sadly you're probably right and it is just a garden variety cap.

 

There are a lot of fakes of this type but most we see are casts from the same master as this one. Most diagnostic is the obverse entering with flan flaw at left and the banker's mark on the cheek.

 

Point taken, though materials used may also impact the effectiveness of that curved surface. Admitting that a rounded die may theoretically be useable, I'm not aware of any evidence that the Romans used round-topped dies.

 

And your point is also taken

Maybe it is a purposeful artistic invention... the designer/engraver opting to round the die to evoke Vulcan's cap.

By the way, here's a CNG listing which calls that object Vulcan's cap rather than a die. https://www.cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=99028