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Is this a genuine counterfeit or counterfeit counterfeit?
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<p>[QUOTE="messydesk, post: 7944634, member: 1765"]Yes. The New Orleans Mafia was established in the late 19th century. The size of the counterfeiting operation required a fairly significant investment, as coins were good silver, and disciplined logistical practices for undetected manufacturing and distribution. If they stopped because someone was caught, then there'd be records of it in the Treasury Department archives. If they stopped because silver got too expensive for the operation to be worth the risk, we may never know.</p><p><br /></p><p>I picked 1905-1910 because silver was cheap then and people losing their jobs at the NO mint were available. The host coins were still high grade, so not very old. No 1921 Morgans or Peace dollars have been tied to this family of counterfeits. The Pittman Act would have provided cover for the disposal of a lot of these.</p><p><br /></p><p>If they were careful to make these look older than they were, using only older coins that they could find in good-enough condition, they could have been made in the early 1930s, when silver was very cheap and the profit margin would have been high. The boss at the time was "Silver Dollar Sam" Carollo. In 1934, he was instrumental in getting slot machines installed throughout Louisiana and was running a pretty big illegal gambling ring, which would have been a great way to move the coins into circulation. The low grade of most of these may indicate that they were intentionally worn down a bit to look old before being distributed, although much of that is actual circulation wear.</p><p><br /></p><p>Max Mehl's 1947 Will W. Neil Collection sale lists a "1900 Microscopic O. Very good, but very rare. Only two or three specimens known," as lot 161. This is the earliest mention of this variety. An uncirculated specimen of a 1902-O VAM 3 supposedly traces to the collection of someone who died in WWII, but this hasn't been corroborated.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="messydesk, post: 7944634, member: 1765"]Yes. The New Orleans Mafia was established in the late 19th century. The size of the counterfeiting operation required a fairly significant investment, as coins were good silver, and disciplined logistical practices for undetected manufacturing and distribution. If they stopped because someone was caught, then there'd be records of it in the Treasury Department archives. If they stopped because silver got too expensive for the operation to be worth the risk, we may never know. I picked 1905-1910 because silver was cheap then and people losing their jobs at the NO mint were available. The host coins were still high grade, so not very old. No 1921 Morgans or Peace dollars have been tied to this family of counterfeits. The Pittman Act would have provided cover for the disposal of a lot of these. If they were careful to make these look older than they were, using only older coins that they could find in good-enough condition, they could have been made in the early 1930s, when silver was very cheap and the profit margin would have been high. The boss at the time was "Silver Dollar Sam" Carollo. In 1934, he was instrumental in getting slot machines installed throughout Louisiana and was running a pretty big illegal gambling ring, which would have been a great way to move the coins into circulation. The low grade of most of these may indicate that they were intentionally worn down a bit to look old before being distributed, although much of that is actual circulation wear. Max Mehl's 1947 Will W. Neil Collection sale lists a "1900 Microscopic O. Very good, but very rare. Only two or three specimens known," as lot 161. This is the earliest mention of this variety. An uncirculated specimen of a 1902-O VAM 3 supposedly traces to the collection of someone who died in WWII, but this hasn't been corroborated.[/QUOTE]
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