I posted this question over in the World Coins section, also. Sorry for the double post. The below 8 Reales was "found in the sand" up in NJ. It is about 40mm in size, and the person who found it claims it is made of silver. I have my doubts as to if the "coin" is real, without holding it in my mitts its hard to tell. Any help would be appreciated.
I have absolutely no doubt that if the coin was found where you said it was found, that it is real. Anything that comes out of the sand in NJ is real, believe me!
Thanks for the reply, Dan. I’m not to sure about the oML mintmark for that time period Cob. Thanks again, Jim
I don't know anything about world coins but this coin looks funny...some of the rim (what is left of it) has straight sides....It seems to me it would jagged.... I wouldn't buy this coin unless I could see it...hold it...and I might not even then!! Speedy
There is a reason for the detail - whether the coin is genuine or not. It is supposed to be a presentation piece, sometimes called a Royal strike. These coins were minted with special care and attention to detail. They were almost always minted on round planchets and fully struck. They were also made in very small numbers. Now I have no idea if this coin is genuine or not as I indicated in my post in the World/Ancient Forum about it. But the legends, the details, the date, the assayers mark - they all appear to be correct. If genuine and intact it should weigh approx 26.7 to 27 grams. But since it is clipped - knowing the weight would not be much help. Speedy the reason the coin has straight edges is because it appears the coin has been clipped - small pieces of the coin have been cut off the edge. This was a common practice used by those trying to cheat the monetary system. Cut small pieces from the edges of the coins, save the silver or gold cut off - and spend the coin for full value.
That's an old practice. Not to slide off topic, but wasn't there a rule in Rome that a certain portion of the coin had to be full, like the bust couldn't be even partially clipped?
No idea if that is true or not - it may well be. But clipping was all too common until well into the 18th century.
My gut reaction is that it's a fake. A presentation piece found in the sand somewhere? I doubt it. Get it authenticated by a reputable dealer or service.
I can't tell you the number of times I have encountered a fake coin only to be told by the collector it belonged too that there is no way it is fake as it "was in my grandfather's drawer for fifty years," or "my great aunt found this 75 years ago," or "it was purchased from the estate of an old collector that has passed away." You have to realize, fakes are not a modern invention. Just because a coin was dug up in the sand, or just because it has been in a coin folder for the last 50 years, does guarantee its authenticity. As for rather this one is real or not, I do not know enough to say for certain personally.
"Cut small pieces from the edges of the coins, save the silver or gold cut off - and spend the coin for full value." can I do that with bills?
Clipping also came in the form of shaving the edges so the coin stayed "round". If I remember correctly, the whole point of reeding on coins was to deter the practice.
That's correct lawdog Now can anyone tell me when the practice of using reeded edges first started and where ? If they did it on Morgan's Speedy - I never heard of it.
My opinion is that it is fake. "Presentation" pieces as a rule did not get circulated or clipped. On the other hand the irregular edges are perfectly reasonable for a cob piece. Note the upper left quadrant of the left image. The planchet extends out beyond the design. This would be consistant with a cob, but not a presentation piece. But the strike is much too bold for it to be a cob.
Milled coins were introduced in England in 1652 in Charles II's reign. Couldn't find a quick reference to an earlier milled edge coin, but that doesn't mean there weren't any... Don
1652 ? - that is different than the information I have - what's your source Don ? In 1639, French engineer Pierre Blondeau perfected milling around the edge of coins to prevent clipping. Taking advantage of the new technique, Louis XIII of France instituted a complete recoinage the following year with milled-edge coins, including a newly designed Louis d'or of 0.21 oz (6.75 grams). Louis banished hammered coins from his mint in 1645. Blondeau later worked for the royal mint in England, and issued the first British coins with milled edges in 1663. He also urged a complete recoinage, too, but it was not undertaken until 1696.