Reply to Thread

Message:: [QUOTE="red_spork, post: 2787060, member: 74282"]First off, the usual disclosure that I am not a lawyer, nor is this intended to be legal advice and you should speak to a lawyer knowledgeable on these issues if you have questions or for information on your specific concerns The answer to this question is complex. I assume you're asking about the coins posted in <a href="https://www.cointalk.com/threads/looking-to-get-my-first-coin-does-these-appear-real-to-you-really-nervous.299110/" class="internalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="https://www.cointalk.com/threads/looking-to-get-my-first-coin-does-these-appear-real-to-you-really-nervous.299110/">this thread</a> and I'm making the assumption you're in the US like most members here seem to be, but if not, your locals laws may and likely will be completely different. There are a few reasons coins can potentially be confiscated by US customs. One uncommon reason is that there is direct evidence or suspicion that the coins were smuggled or illegally exported from the country they were found in. Unless you're buying coins direct from Greece or Italy(in which case they're probably fake if they don't have export paperwork FWIW), you don't have to worry much about this. The most relevant one for most collectors are the MOUs or Memoranda of Understanding. These are agreements made between the Cultural Property Advisory Committee(CPAC), a division within the US Department of State, and other nations, generally source countries for antiquities such as Egypt, Italy, Greece, etc. These agreements are ostensibly short-term agreements meant to address looting and generally take the form of a list of items for which import is restricted unless the item meets certain criteria such as having provenance(collecting history) showing it was out of [source country] before a given date, having provenance showing it has been out of [source country] for at least 10 years or having an export certificate issued by the government of [source country]. Essentially, in these cases these artifacts are treated as guilty(of being recently looted) until proven innocent by the government and as such the onus is on the collector to prove their innocence. Most collectors I've spoken with feel this is deeply anti-American and unconstitutional but this post is informational rather than political so I won't dive into that here, but please <a href="http://www.accg.us/home.aspx" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.accg.us/home.aspx" rel="nofollow">join the ACCG</a> if you feel the same way. Some examples of source countries and some examples of what they restrict(note this is NOT meant to be a definitive list): Italy - the following coin types are restricted in the absence of either provenance prior to January 2011 or an export certificate fro the Republic of Italy<ul> <li>Roman Republic and Etruscan struck coins prior to about 211 B.C. including Romano-Campanian issues</li> <li>Early Italian(including Roman) cast issues - google aes rude, aes grave and aes signatum for examples</li> <li>Struck Roman colonial issues from Italy prior to 37 A.D.</li> <li>Issues of the Greek cities in Italy prior to 200 B.C.</li> </ul> Greece - The following coin types are restricted in the absence of either provenance prior to December 2011 or an export certificate from Greece<ul> <li>Bronze coins struck in the territory of the modern Greek state from approximately the 5th century B.C. to the 1st century B.C.</li> <li>Smaller silver coins weighing approximately 10g or less(so does not apply to big trade coins like tetradrachms) struck in the territory of the modern Greek state</li> <li>Roman coins in silver and bronze struck in the territory of the modern Greek state from approximately the late 2nd century B.C. to the 3rd century A.D.</li> </ul>Egypt - The following coin types are restricted in the absence of either provenance prior to December 2016 or an export certificate from Egypt<ul> <li>Hellenistic or Ptolemaic coins in gold, silver and bronze struck within the boundaries of the modern Egyptian state from circa 332 B.C. to 31 B.C.</li> <li>So-called nwb-nfr coins which may be related to Dynasty 30 with hieroglyphs nwb-nfr on one side and a horse on the other</li> <li>Roman coins struck in silver or bronze at any mint in the modern Egyptian state from circa 31 B.C. to 294 A.D.</li> </ul> OK, so those are some of the big restrictions we run into but there are others(i.e. Bulgaria). Where does this leave us with the two coins you were previously interested in? I do not think there is any evidence of recent looting, and unless you do, I do not think you need to worry about that. The Trajan's Column denarius was struck in Rome, Italy during the rule of Trajan and because this period is not listed under the Italian MOU is completely free and clear of import problems. The Antony denarius is a little less certain. These may have been struck in Patrae, Greece depending on whose work you read and what you believe. Some authors simply list the mint as "uncertain" and feel that there are several candidates for it across the Mediterranean. Some collectors feel that these coins fall under the Greek MOU, others do not. It's really a grey area, but I've never heard of an Antony denarius confiscated because of the MOU. If I were not completely certain of the mint attribution I might simply ask a seller to make sure that any printed or handwritten tags included with the coin list the mint as uncertain because that's what I'd want to have for my own personal references. Take that how you will. That's my two cents. As I said, I don't think you're at any risk with the Trajan denarius and my Antony denarius came from overseas as well and had no problems "sailing" right through customs but you should be aware of the possible complications as discussed above.[/QUOTE]

Create my FREE Account!

Log in or Sign up

Reply to Thread

Useful Searches