Is the PCGS Secure worth that much more?

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by Beefer518, Oct 15, 2017.

  1. Beefer518

    Beefer518 Well-Known Member

    I just watched a PCGS Secure MS-64 1927 Vermont (Coin A below) go for $405.00.

    I just bought a PCGS MS-64 1927 Vermont (Coin B) for $224.01.

    Now I'm well aware that (monster) toning can bring nice premiums, but the toning on coin A (IMO) is attractive at best, but certainly not monster. I wouldn't think it would warrant a premium of $180 (nearly double). So, what was it that made this coin go so high? Was it the toning, the PCGS Secure holder, a combination of both, or what? Were the difference in the seller's photos worth the added price? Not to mention that ugly black streak across the mountain lion's back....

    Or did I just get a heckuva deal?

    Coin A ($405)

    405 vermont Obv.jpg 405 vermont Rev.jpg


    Coin B

    1927 Vermont Obv.jpg 1927 Vermont Rev.jpg
     
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  3. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    Coin A, Fugo, ugo.......keep up the search.
     
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  4. Beefer518

    Beefer518 Well-Known Member

    I was the one who bought coin B :D
     
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  5. green18

    green18 Unknown member Sweet on Commemorative Coins Supporter

    Praise God......
     
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  6. Santinidollar

    Santinidollar Supporter! Supporter

    Your momma didn't raise an idiot.:D
     
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  7. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    Huh, the first is a Slider at best! Old cleaning.
     
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  8. BlackBeard_Thatch

    BlackBeard_Thatch Captain of the Queen Anne's Revenge

    Toning looks like a petri dish :yuck::yawn:
     
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  9. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    Your's probably did sell a little low from blurry scans. The first one was probably part toning (not my favorite but some like that dirty look on commens), part getting hit with the BP on top of their bid price, part just auctions can be funny and go real low on time and higher another. A secure premium wouldn't be that large, it's usually pretty modest but some buyers will pay a little more for them having the TrueView ect
     
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  10. cpm9ball

    cpm9ball CANNOT RE-MEMBER

    IMHO, there is only one reason why Coin A sold for that much................bidiots!

    Chris
     
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  11. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    I saw the auction for coin A and was very surprised by the result as well. Either someone saw something or it was just a case of overbidding. The MS-64 (untoned) that I had I bought and sold for $204, so your coin B price seems in line with the market while coin A went for too much in my opinion.
     
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  12. Oldrdawg

    Oldrdawg Active Member

    I just hope that the person who bought coin A is still around when I sell my collection . . .
     
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  13. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    This is an example of the current state of affairs in toning. It's ridiculous. I will say, though, the second coin is kind of blurry. :troll:o_O Interesting amount of die rotation.
     
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  14. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    I would disagree. The coin sale is an outlier but the premium can't simply be attributed to toning. Most toning collectors would say that example is unattractive and offer less than for a blast white example. Now if it had rainbow colors, you might have seen a price in the 1000s and could have talked about ridiculous toning premiums.
     
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  15. Beefer518

    Beefer518 Well-Known Member

    Ya know, I must have been tired. As much as I saw the rotated reverse, it didn't dawn on me until you said something.
     
  16. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    I'm curious - when did you achieve the ability to read the winning bidder's mind? I just go by what I see, and I see ugly toning bringing "stupid money", over and over again.
     
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  17. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    I'm also curious when you achieved the ability to read bidders and say that toning caused this? What if it was PCGS secure holder enthusiasts or Vermont hoarders? Or even shill bidders.

    By the way, we have a 100+ page thread on toning premiums and if you took a look there then you would see the kind of toning that has been selling for a premium and the kind that hasn't.
     
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  18. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    I’m quite aware that people who are toning experts only bid up attractive toning. There are a ton of wannabe bidiots who bid up ALL toning, some of it ugly as sin, but it still goes up and up and up.
     
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  19. Mike at APMEX

    Mike at APMEX Member

    Sorry guys but I disagree - a little bit. The "A" Vermont has original toning gained from years of storage in the cardboard distribution holders that the three VT banks who distriubuted them used. It imparts that gold streaky toning. Grading is subjective for certain, but that coin is a real mint state example IMHO. Many collectors and dealers pay extra for originality. If the coin had monster rainbow color it would have brought a 4-digit price. The PCGS Secure holder should not have affected the price at all. "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder" and I happen to like that Vermont and NO it wasnt mine and I didnt bid on it. Thanks for listening to a different opinion.
     
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  20. Sundance79

    Sundance79 Active Member

    I love a beautifully, even toned coin. But this is not one of them. Frankly, I don't care how original that toning might be, it just isn't appealing. I see a lot of toned coins that go for high premiums that I wouldn't put in my safe. Yet I know some collectors seek them out. Like Morgans with the bag pattern toning. This weekend I bought a beautiful Type I Buffalo for $100 more than a similar coin with no toning. The one I bought had a beautiful even gold tone. The one without any toning (it looked like it was minted yesterday) had a dead look in comparison.
    I just don't understand the appeal of coins that look like they have a creeping fungus on them - no way!!
     
  21. Mike at APMEX

    Mike at APMEX Member

    If we all liked the exact same thing, how boring would life be! The fact that you may like or hate the toning that appeals to me allows me to buy things that you wouldnt like. Some collectors will only buy toned coins because bright ones have been dipped. Some only like bright coins. Its just simply a matter of preference. If something is eye-appealing to me, I believe that it will likely be eye-appealing to someone else.
     
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