Is it worth more now? Eliasberg 1894-S Dime crosses to PCGS

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Beefer518, Dec 24, 2020.

  1. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    Well, there is a stolen bag of 1928 Saints, 250 of them that were taken in the early-1930's ! :D

    But as for your outrage...it was over 100 years ago, NOBODY could have forseen what they would be worth today. The guy isn't benefitting...not even his kids are benefitting....nor his grandkids.
     
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  3. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    You really don’t think he knew a coin with a mintage of under 30 would be worth a fortune?

    People collected coins even back in those days. Heck people collected coins all the way back to the Roman Empire. Emperor Augustus was known to be a fervent coin collector and often rewarded friends & allies with rare exotic coins from the far ends of the empire and beyond.

    Coin collecting was called the “Hobby of Kings” and it’s a well known fact that the lower a coins mintage is the more valuable it will be.
     
  4. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Not really.

    If people keep making the same moot point that they were intended for circulation then I am going to keep reminding them that they never made it into circulation and thus should’ve been melted or auctioned off by the government.

    It was a case of fraud and just because he wasn’t punished or prosecuted for it doesn’t mean it wasn’t.
     
  5. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Oh really?

    Just because two of them weren’t stored properly or taken care of doesn’t really change anything.

    If I had a family member who somehow was able to steal a 1933 Double Eagle from Fort Knox and it was damaged in my care does that really change the fact that I received a stolen 1933 Double Eagle? Nope!

    You’re saying the Mint director never gave them to his daughter to sell for a fortune?

    Because from what I’ve read it sounds like that’s exactly what happened.

    Daddy worked at the Mint. Daddy conspired to get his hands on coins that no one else could get. Then Daddy gave those coins to his baby girl who sold them for a fortune.

    That’s exactly what Mint employees funding a luxurious retirement at taxpayer expense is.
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
  6. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Maybe. All I know is if it happened today and the Mint got caught making coins just for themselves in limited numbers and gave them away to friends & family and no one else could even hope to see one let alone get one they would not only be fired but thrown in prison for a few years.

    Basically this is the 1913 Liberty Nickel & 1933 Double Eagle situation that happened back in a time when fraud like that was rarely prosecuted even though it would be prosecuted if it had happened even a few decades later.
     
  7. Gam3rBlake

    Gam3rBlake Well-Known Member

    Oh yeah, and I bet if the descendants of whoever stole those 250 1928 Saints took them all into PCGS or NGC to be graded and sold and explained to them that their great great grandfather stole them from the Mint the US government would immediately demand that they be returned as they are US government property.

    Just like they did with the 1933 Double Eagles. Only King Farouk of Egypt’s 1933 Double Eagle is legal to own. The rest were confiscated.
     
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  8. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    Nobody knew the dies would not be used. It's just the way things turned out.
     
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  9. CamaroDMD

    CamaroDMD [Insert Clever Title] Supporter

    Some were circulated. There are known examples of this coin which are well circulated. These coins were intended to go into circulation.

    My understanding is these coins really aren't "proofs" but were just struck with brand new dies. My guess is, if they had struck more these coins would be "PL."

    Again...the intention was to mint more. A whole lot more. These were minted early in the year. They would not have known these would be the only coins minted. How do you not understand this?
     
  10. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    You are convinced of your own narrative and are just making things up to justify it. An elderly banker's daughter (not a mint employee's daughter, and presumably the origin of the "ice cream" story) sold her remaining two coins to Earl Parker in 1949 for $2750 each. It was a lot of money, but not a "fortune", and it didn't fund any "luxurious retirement at taxpayer expense". It's also a fact that two well-circulated examples were pulled from circulation. It is simply not true that a mint employee deliberately minted a rarity in order to profit from it. You can believe what you want, but facts are important to the rest of us.
     
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  11. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    You mean at the taxpayers PROFIT? The money would be paid for first of all so no there is no expense and most importantly such items bring in millions and millions and millions in tax dollars are they are sold over the years. There absolutely is no expense and it would actually be a massive profit
     
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  12. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    Not even remotely close to the same as stealing

    Legally the government and the mint have forfeited all legal claims to them by allowing them to be openly sold for so long. Short of a corrupt judge their case would immediately be thrown out of court
     
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  13. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    There's plenty of example of coins with a lower mintage selling for less than ones with higher mintages

    Not really. The 33 Eagle was entirely political, hence it took a decade to get after it. One was given to a foreign leader and they decided to go after the others, at that point it was a high enough profile that agents were using the issue to make their careers.

    Not exactly. They aren't all accounted for and there's evidence the Farouk coin isn't even actually the Farouk coin.
     
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  14. CamaroDMD

    CamaroDMD [Insert Clever Title] Supporter

    Really? I hadn't heard that. Can you elaborate?
     
  15. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    Something along the lines of there's a suspicion from some that one of the owners had more than one and they swapped a lower quality one and sold that as the Farouk coin keeping the nicer one for themselves
     
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  16. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    I believe I have posted here before (maybe a thread) that a Treasury official in the 1950's was on record as stating that he saw no reason NOT to confiscate the 1913 Liberty Heads and other "mistakes" that got out of the Mint.

    Not sure if that included the 1933 Indian Head Eagle ($10), which has all 35-40 LEGAL because 4-6 of them left the Mint under legal/authorized means and they can't tell which is which so all get legal status. But he clearly meant the Liberty Head Nickle, some patterns, and other coins you vets are aware of that left the Mint under questionable circumstances even if they have been legally sold for decades.
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
  17. CamaroDMD

    CamaroDMD [Insert Clever Title] Supporter

    Interesting. I hadn’t heard that.
     
  18. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    Don't forget the guy who turned in his 1933 Saint a few years back voluntarily. :mad::mad::mad:
     
  19. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    People can say whatever they want, doesn't mean it would be legal or that they could do it

    "Voluntarily" Once the Langboards lost if you knew you were on their radar you pretty much had to or potentially face charges
     
    serdogthehound likes this.
  20. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    Rigged case....I would have hidden the coin. :D
     
  21. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    Pretty sure I would have dropped it somewhere before they came looking for it. Must have run off with some of those ballpoint pens that are always disappearing.
     
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