Is It Real?

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by yakpoo, Jul 15, 2020.

  1. yakpoo

    yakpoo Member

    I dabble with day-trading in the mornings and one of my news sources had an NGC ad showing an NGS-graded MS-62 1893-S Morgan Dollar (5743697-001).

    Initially, I didn't doubt the authenticity of the coin. I just wanted to see a better picture of this valuable coin, so I used the NGC lookup tool...

    https://www.ngccoin.com/certlookup/5743697-001/62/

    Note: If some other coin appears initially, just hit the "search" button and the correct coin should appear. If not, just manually insert the Cert#.

    I collect/hoard Morgan dollars, but haven't studied them in detail (yet). However, the one characteristic I always expect to see is (what I call) the "Elvis Lip" (upper lip curling down...like this HA example for comparison):

    [​IMG]

    Instead of the upper lip curving downward, the NGC coin has an upper lip that curls up! Please follow the NGC link (above) to see the coin in question.

    So...the question is...is the coin in the NGC link "Real"...or a fake?
    (Sorry, I don't seem able to post the NGC image directly.)
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
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  3. Evan8

    Evan8 A Little Off Center

    I bet it's just some sort of trick on the mind, as those NGC slab shots are always poorly photographed. I'm willing to bet it's probably real.
     
  4. yakpoo

    yakpoo Member

    Optical illusion? I doubt it...did you click to magnify? The NGC coin looks like a blow-up doll (so I've been told).

    On the other hand, I agree, I doubt NGC would use an erroneously slabbed fake as an advertisement! Therein lies the rub.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
  5. Evan8

    Evan8 A Little Off Center

    Yeah probably. Those NGC pics always suck.
     
  6. yakpoo

    yakpoo Member

    Well, if you use the NGC magnify tool, you can get a clean picture and can clearly see that it's not an optical illusion. I'm wondering if it's an undocumented die variety...or a fake...or what?

    The Van Allen-Mallis catalog of Morgan and Peace Dollars lists only one Obverse die (III² 1 - pages 69-70) for the 1893-S...and it doesn't have blow-up doll lips.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
  7. SorenCoins

    SorenCoins Well-Known Member

    Aside from the already mentioned fact that it is difficult to tell from those dark NGC slab photos, I wonder if any sort of die polishing might have swept away the lower part of her upper lip. If so, it might create the appearance of an upward curve. That's my best guess if the NGC photos are not playing a trick on us.
     
  8. expat

    expat Remember you are unique, just like everyone else

    If you go onto Vamworld, click Morgan dollars by date then choose 1893s you will find details about authentic marks on Vam1 and Vam2. Also due to the large number of fakes a "fakes gallery" of fotos of fakes has been compiled
     
    yakpoo likes this.
  9. yakpoo

    yakpoo Member

    I guess it's an optical illusion...hmmm, Ok.
     
  10. yakpoo

    yakpoo Member

    Thanks, nice site! Unfortunately, no blow-up doll lips. I don't know how, but the consensus seems to be "optical illusion". This is like getting a chocolate rabbit for Easter...only to find out it's hollow. :(
     
    expat likes this.
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