Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Insider, Jul 2, 2020.

  1. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    If I ran a grading room and speed, cost, etc. were of no importance - just a reliable, precise, take it or leave it unchanging grade...

    Grading would be Free. You pay for authentication ONLY.

    If a coin required grading. It would be examined with magnification by professional grader #1 and input. Then another professional #2 would input their grade. The order would be put away for a few days. Then it would be sent back to be graded again. First grader #2, then grader #1, and then professional grader #3. A finalizer would see four separate grading opinions and note any differences over time by grader #1 and #2. On occasion, some coins would need to be discussed. A final grade would be assigned and the coin would be imaged. That would be its grade from now on if it remained in the same condition.

    :hilarious::hilarious::hilarious::hilarious::hilarious::D:p FAT CHANCE!
    Dynoking, Kentucky, wxcoin and 2 others like this.
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  3. johnmilton

    johnmilton Well-Known Member

    There is too much money to be made from crack-outs for the TPGs and the owners of the coins for that to happen.
    Derek2200 likes this.
  4. QuintupleSovereign

    QuintupleSovereign Well-Known Member

    The way I see it, grading objectivity is only really possible for AG-MS broadly defined. Once we start hashing out the difference between a MS-64 and a MS-65, it's too difficult to come up with a predefined numerical criteria to justify assigning one grade over the other.
    harrync and thomas mozzillo like this.
  5. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    Agree. This post is made to PUT SOME LIFE INTO THIS FORUM!

    Actually, G to MS is where most of the differences occur!
    CamaroDMD and capthank like this.
  6. Mountain Man

    Mountain Man Well-Known Member

    In a perfect world . . . maybe that would be the best way to grade a coin, but I doubt you could find three professional graders to work for nothing. LOL
    imrich, Insider and baseball21 like this.
  7. cpm9ball

    cpm9ball CANNOT RE-MEMBER

    Great! Why don't you buy NGC or PCGS and I'll be the first to sign up. ;)

    Crack-outs would be illegal! :greedy:

    ~ Chris
    Beefer518 likes this.
  8. desertgem

    desertgem MODERATOR Senior Errer Collecktor Moderator

    How about a deal for Lifetime grading/authentication ( no commercial entities) for $$$$?

    or same for 1 Year for $$$$ ?

    :):cat::chicken::coldfeet::coldfeet::dead: Jim
    cpm9ball likes this.
  9. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    News Flash! An ideal grading service WOULD NOT BE DEPENDENT on income. The organization would be truly INDEPENDENT. Perhaps funded by a large endowment that would generated ALL expenses PLUS additional profit.

    AFAIK, ANACS was the first coin Authentication Service in the U.S.A. At first, they lost money but by the early 1970's, the ANA decided to move the company to CO to bring all the revenue and control inhouse. Thus :bucktooth: loosing all the museum and government assets that required it to be in DC in the first place! :(
    It was a case of the tail (ANACS) :greedy::greedy::greedy::greedy: wagging the dog (rest of the association).

    With the amount of revenue generated in DC, ANACS became like an independent "Ivory Tower." After dumping several of our consultants and old time authenticator "ex-perts" who proved to be liabilities, the opinions of ANACS were truly independent.

    IF the ANACS had decided to release the internal records of each coin's grade that were kept for its identification in the future, that opinion would also have been a TOTALLY PROFESSIONAL and INDEPENDENT OPINION that was NOT SUBJECT TO ANY PRESSURE FROM ANYONE!

    Additionally, a very little known fact is that the FIRST COIN GRADING SERVICE in the U.S.A. was at the IINS Authentication Bureau. Grades were provided for FREE because grading is a subjective opinion!

    PS A few months before the ANACS started grading coins FOR A FEE, one of the biggest coin firms in the country threatened to sue INSAB out of business if we continued to grade coins because we had called a gold dollar they were involved with AU. Thankfully, that never happened because before we were sued, the ANA started their own coin grading service. :D

    The commercialization of coin grading by coin dealers for their own interests and profit IS THE AMERICAN WAY :D and I have no problem with folks working hard making money. USA, USA, USA!
    capthank likes this.
  10. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    cpm9ball, posted: Great! Why don't you buy NGC or PCGS and I'll be the first to sign up. ;)

    LOL, folks better hope I don't ever win a mega-million lottery prize because my company would review slabs FOR FREE. I already have the self destruct stickers that I had made in 1990! ;)
    dwhiz and Jack D. Young like this.
  11. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    I don't think that would work. As soon as something is virtually free...

    Most of us are very lucky to have fellow numismatists to "bounce" our coins off. Heck, I miss the old days before TPGS.
    john65999 and Mainebill like this.
  12. messydesk

    messydesk Well-Known Member

    and MS is where most of the money occurs.
    john65999 likes this.
  13. cpm9ball

    cpm9ball CANNOT RE-MEMBER

    Why $$$$? How about $$$? ~ Chris;)
  14. cpm9ball

    cpm9ball CANNOT RE-MEMBER

    Yeah, but you know what most (not all!) people think of any TPG below #2.
    ~ Chris
  15. micbraun

    micbraun coindiccted

    I’d ban modern coins entirely and would only focus on truly collectible coins :)

    Some other ideas:
    - there would be 3 instead of two types of grades: 1) straight grade 2) details/minor issue 3) details/major issues such as harsh cleaning, polishing or graffiti
    - in order to qualify for an MS grade, a coin actually needs to be uncirculated Lol
    - no plus grades, but an AU58 would need to be an outstanding coin with minimal wear only, star grades are used
    - variety attribution is always included, it’s not optional
    - high res pictures are always taken before the coin is graded; pictures are displayed on the certificate screen
    - all 3 graders stay in the room until they agree on a grade (just imagine Doug was with you :)
    capthank likes this.
  16. TypeCoin971793

    TypeCoin971793 Just a random guy on the internet

    If I ran the grading room, there would be no grading except to note problems. Authenticity would be guaranteed. Thus people be forced to look at the COINS instead of the slab labels.
  17. messydesk

    messydesk Well-Known Member

    How about all 3 graders stay in the room until they agree with Doug?
  18. micbraun

    micbraun coindiccted

    That’s more or less what I had in mind :)
    messydesk likes this.
  19. QuintupleSovereign

    QuintupleSovereign Well-Known Member

    Assuming that that service also came with a lower price point, I would definitely be an active user!
  20. Lehigh96

    Lehigh96 Toning Enthusiast

    I have often said on this forum that a coin can be graded multiple times, with different grades, and each time still be graded correctly.

    How many times have you looked at a coin and thought, that coin is high end MS64 or low end MS65? If you think of each numerical grade incrementally from MS6X.0 to MS6X.9 and then consider that a coin will never have a perfect number, but rather a range of grades about a half grade long, then a coin could easily be graded MS64 one day, MS65 the next, and still be correct both days. We assign a specific grade, but in actuality, the coin has a grading range. So when we run into a coin with an MS64.8-MS65.3 range, we then are forced to decide which grade to choose. Often that choice depends upon personal preferences of the grader.

    Perhaps if we shifted our mindset from each coin having an exact grade to each coin having a correct grading range, we will in a position to better understand and accept the inherent subjectivity in grading.
    baseball21, Mainebill, wxcoin and 2 others like this.
  21. Lehigh96

    Lehigh96 Toning Enthusiast

    Our current turnaround time is 47 years.
    dwhiz, baseball21, Kentucky and 3 others like this.
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