If PCGS is betther than NGC...?

Good point. Well played

 

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to prove my point look at these two examples:
NGC ms67
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NGC-MS67-20...79?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item51a1c6144f
same coin PCGS Ms67
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2012-S-Acad...D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

now if the NGC coins were as good as the PCGS ones why are people not breaking them out of the NGC holders? the PCGS ms67's do not have ticks in the fields the NGC's do have ticks in the fields

 

my observation is that NGC has more over graded coins

 

Now try to make that comparison with world coins. You will find exactly the opposite. PCGS holders so many world coins as MS that are mid-grade AU that it's not even funny! Ask anyone who has ever tried to cross-over their PCGS world coins to NGC and see what they tell you. Most don't cross at PCGS grade (even when they are cracked out and sent in raw to NGC).

Regarding the "Break out" game for the two coins you showed -- Why on earth would someone break them out? You're talking about hassle, time, effort, etc. for a modern coin minted by the multi-millions. The crack-out "game" doesn't make any sense to people who collect coins for what they are -- coins. That 2012 quarter graded MS67 by PCGS going for nearly $140 is just stupid. I'm sorry, there's no sugar coating that one.

 

the PCGS were $200+ a few months ago with none going below $200- I am glad they are going down as I want one

 

I guess that depends on your definition of 'World'. For mint state Canadian coins, PCGS is fairly strict, yet consistent, so the best of my Canadian collection are in PCGS holders, or slowly migrating to PCGS holders. Also, there is a slippery slope here - once you start a PCGS Registry or Showcase set, you tend to stick with it, build upon it. I am at the point now, where if I acquire a NGC graded coin, I find myself cracking it out and submitting it to PCGS, because I want to augment my PCGS showcase sets or try an upgrade to my registry sets.

At Canadian coin shows, aside from the mylar flips from Canadian grading companies, the most common hard slabs seen on the bourse floor and auctions are PCGS. That is merely an observation.

 

The reason, from what I can gather, that people crack coins out of NGC holders to send to PCGS, is because coins graded by PCGS, on average, sell for more, even if for the same grade. That's the result of better marketing. Not better quality. There's coins under graded and over graded by both companies. I think this whole "PCGS is so much better than NGC" mentality needs to stop. Nothing against PCGS, I think they're a fantastic company. But people's praise of them sometimes borders on deification, and it's a bit creepy.

 

(generally) PCS are better when buying already slabbed coins and NGC are better when submitting. That is because you are more likely to get higher grade from NGC

 

I just wanted to quote this because you said PCS is better already slabbed than NGC... PCS, a self-grader. *Yes, I know it's a typo... I just found it funny.*

Also, to address some other issues in this thread:

1) Numismatic Guaranty Corporation of America (NGC) has shareholders. That's part of what makes it a CORPORATION. It's not publicly traded, so there are different regulations that apply to how they operate, but they're a for-profit corporation. As such, the actions of their marketing department are with the intent of increasing profitability.

2) NGC might grade non-North American coins with more stringency. This probably has more to do with niche marketing than anything. PCGS has established itself in the US coins market. There might be cases with "world" coins where PCGS grades looser than NGC, but that's likely only for non-modern issues, as there isn't/aren't enough history/understanding/exemplars in the PCGS library yet. With time, that should change.

2a) NGC sort of increased the market for PCGS coins. By allowing individuals to use PCGS coins in the NGC registry, NGC eliminates one of the reasons someone *might* have had for crossing a coin into an NGC holder. There are others, but the open registry likely hurts NGC a lot more than it helps.

 

I wonder how often NGC and PCGS bid on being the official service. The last time I remember was many years ago. It was a big deal and all the figures were laid out for everyone to see. There were several factors used in making the decision but I can't remember what all they were. NGC made the best offer at the time and won.

I see them as equals but use the service I feel is best for each coin. I'm glad there is more than one choice.

 

well for our sake why dont you put a list of where you think ngc is better where you think pcgs is better and where you think they are equal just your take your opinion. that should be good enough for most of us most of the time

 

I'm partial to NGC simply because i feel they are more consistent in regards to the coins I collect (Jefferson Nickels). They may be a little more lenient in regards to grading MS67 but they grade consistent; which, in my opinion is the most important thing. Also, PCGS doesn't designate between 5 steps and 6, which I don't like.

Like I said, this is only my opinion in respect to grading high grade Jeffersons. It may be a totally different story with a different coin.

 

I've noticed that a lot collectors of classic U.S. coins tend to, on average, prefer PCGS, while collectors of world, ancient and modern (post 1950) U.S. coins tend to prefer NGC. That's just an observation I've noticed. Exceptions abound, of course.

 

I think the preference you refer to is on the submission side, is it not? US moderns in PCGS slabs still garner huge premiums over NGC slabs, on average. And, I'm not saying one is preferred. Just stating what I observe by looking at eBay completed listings.

 

Submissions are indeed what I'm referring to. In terms of ebay, I don't know. Given ebay's past reputations with coins, I find the reliability of info that I may get from them to be a bit sketchy. Aren't coins and slabs faked on there a lot now?

 

I don't see how fake coins/slabs have to do with the original point of your posting this thread. PCGS garners premiums over NGC. It's consistent due to the registry point system. Since NGC accepts PCGS coins in their registry, but not the other way, PCGS coins in the highest grades will always sell at a premium to NGC counterparts, due to the increased demand and lower supply for a specific coin in a specific grade.

Also, submissions for NGC _should_ be higher, since ANA members are allowed to submit, and their price per submission is lower. I have a feeling that prior to the labels changing every other year, ANACS may have received more submissions than NGC based solely on the cost factor. That doesn't mean to say ANACS is better than NGC/PCGS, just that it was used more often.

 

"In early 2004 PCGSA was outbid for the endorsement of PNG as their official grading service. Therefore they had to remove the PNG logo from the hologram on the back. They replaced the PNG logo with an image of a St Gaudins double eagle and their stock exchange symbol. These first appeared around November of 2004 and lasted until mid 2005."

Conder101 posted the above years ago. If they bid every 5 years, it's almost time again.

 

I think that the idea that certain series are dealt with differently by the 2 bigges is an important consideration