I don't get it (old gold coins vs. gold bullion)?

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Still different from what I believed in the wake of previous discussions.

I'm not sure if it's "illegal to hold" them -- there's no penalty as long as you turn them over on demand -- but on balance, on this issue, I think @Doc J is closer to right than I was.

Thanks, both of you, for helping me learn another thing today!

 

Do you go to coin shops and coin shows to monitor for fakes being sold and hang out to see how they handle it months and years later? You haven't bought or sold a coin in a decade by your own admission so at best it seems you're thinking about how things were in the old days for you.

Of course raw fake coins are sold in the real world and unless you have a long standing relationship with that seller that you purchased from in person you are basically going to be out of luck if it takes you months or years to figure it out. What is actually going to happen if you're a new buyer/first time/they don't remember you is that most will say they would have never sold a fake and that you must be mistaken where you got it or you are trying to scam them.

It's going to be a fight that the buyer will lose most of the time trying to return a coin years later that you will basically have no proof they ever sold you. It's especially true if you aren't the typical looking elderly collector especially if it was a one off purchase.

So like I said for most people the only true lifetime authenticity guarantee is from the TPGs for coins that haven't been cracked out.

 

I feel sorry for him as well. He is blinded by his dislike for you and this site. You could call a coin round and he would argue with you.

 

Not even close to true, save your pity for the ones being mentored by some of the "experts" here their wallet is going to need it.

 

Point of the matter is US coin gold is an alloy of 90% gold - 10% copper. Actual gold weight is only one issue to consider - the undiscussed issue in determining gold value is the additional cost one would incur refining coin gold to .999 fine.

 

This is the same argument used for .999 fine silver vs coin silver vs sterling and other scrap. The big difference is that gold is very easy to refine to high purity, and has been since antiquity. If you're going to melt it, it doesn't take a lot more resources to refine it at the same time.

That's why there there's little or no refining penalty, at least from what I've seen. 90% tends to trade at the value of its actual gold content. So does 18K and 14K scrap.

 

https://goldchat.blogspot.com/2008/06/gold-value-chain-part-ii-refining.html

"With purity, 99.5% purity gold can be produced using a chlorination process (impure gold is melted and gaseous chlorine is blown through it with the impurities joining with the chlorine). It is rapid and simple and therefore cheap but only goes up to 99.5%. To get to 99.99% you need an electrolytic process (stick impure gold into a solution of hydrochloric acid and gold chloride, pass an electric current through it, the gold dissolves and pure gold moves to a negatively charged electrode). Problem is that this process costs more, mainly due to the need to keep an inventory of gold chloride on hand. It is also slower than chlorination, so you tie up gold in the process for longer."

 

I think the term is, "It's about 97% of an ounce of gold."

 

When I was a kid (10-12 years old), I used to do just that. I would pull out my coin collection, and we would play with 2-cent pieces, 3-cent pieces, half dimes, half dollars, silver dollars, etc. They were all circulated, so no harm, no foul, but it brought an old-west feeling to it.

 

And, if they are a member of the ANA, you have a little extra leverage to make sure they make good on a bad deal.

 

Only if you can actually prove you bought it from them and very few coins would be worth the legal battle trying to establish it. People get told to pound sand all the time being accused of being scammers ect.

This is the whole point you're missing, just because a long time regular buyer or someone who spends 10s of thousands ect can count on that type of return policy doesn't mean the majority of buyers can.

Are there dealers that would error on the side of caution and take it back of course, but those are the exception not the rule for most buyers. There are plenty of dealers where a lot of buyers would be out of luck.

The whole point was theoretical and reality are very different things and it's naive to believe you could be a random or one time buyer and come back years later demanding money from them saying they sold you a raw fake

 

Which would be what? Plenty of the people you guys constantly complain about how they do business are ANA members, some are PNG members too.

 

If they are ANA members, and they don't respond to ethical complaints, they lose their membership. But you have to file a formal complaint. Many dealers who aren't members aren't for a reason.

 

Toothless false protection of yesteryear. Many people aren't ANA members because they see no value in paying into it today. Has nothing to do with ethics.

 

I agree, and am not a member. But if I were a full-time dealer I would be. The one that has no teeth is the Better Business Bureau. Even Goldline is a member of the BBB with an A+ rating. Just pay your dues and you are golden.