How Old is Ancient?

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Mkm5, Feb 18, 2021.

  1. RichardT

    RichardT Well-Known Member

    I really was confused when I read this. It just didn't fit with the usage of the word "decimated" which I've seen through the years. In case anyone else is similarly befuddled... an explanation from this website:
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  3. The Trachy Enjoyer

    The Trachy Enjoyer Well-Known Member

    I would argue that distaste comes classical bias. Gibbon ruined Byzantium's reputation with a hatred of Christianity and suspicion of the Greek "other". This view sadly spread across Europe as each nation wanted to see themselves as heir of Rome and the one empire with a legitimate claim was discarded at the wayside.

    People don't care to learn about the history of Byzantium due to the bias of civilization "ending" with the "fall" of Greece and Rome, only to be saved by the Renaissance. Little do they know, the vast majority of classical greek and roman texts that jumpstarted the Renaissance came from Byzantium. Constantinople served as the safe guard of those classical texts, without which much history and scientific/philosophic progress would have been lost.

    Byzantium not only preserved those texts but actively contributed to all sorts of classical discussion as well as presenting innovating ideas. One only needs to read Psellus to understand that even in the later periods when Byzantium was racked with strife and conflict, centuries after the fall of the West, educated discussion/debate and allusions the classical texts of antiquity were present as before.

    ...oh dear, Im afraid this has turned into a bit of rant. For that, I am sorry haha. This topic is one I am passionate about as I sadly see the Byzantine empire downtrodden by those whose bias completely clouds their perspective...

    Yes, Byzantine artistry in terms of realism is often of a lower quality than Greek and Western Roman counterparts. However, I would argue the fresh and exciting designs more than off set this. Especially in the period of the trachy, one can enjoy a rebirth in coin design with a mixture of elements from antiquity juxtaposed (and often wonderfully integrated with) late medieval Christianity
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  4. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    Ever read "Sailing from Constantinople"? My favorite book detailing how the Byzantines allowed the Renaissance to happen. It was a confluence of factors, ancient greek scholars from Constantinople, libraries from conquest of Moors, and printing press added up to the renaissance.
  5. The Trachy Enjoyer

    The Trachy Enjoyer Well-Known Member

    That book is sitting in my "to read" pile! I found it for under $5 used but haven't gotten around to reading it yet! It sounds like I should bump that up my reading list
  6. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    ah, the age old question....with many right answers...but in the end..... theres no wrong way.jpg
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  7. Victor_Clark

    Victor_Clark all my best friends are dead Romans Dealer

    if you are talking medieval history it most definitely is Western centric as it is the study of European history during the middle ages, It does not concern itself with what is going on in China, India, anywhere in Asia etc, etc, Medieval is a line of study for Europe....period. Sorry if that is Euro-centric, but the other cultures have there own studies and seem to manage, sometimes borrowing the term medieval...and we let them as long as we get it back, but it is our word.
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  8. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    ..yeah man(@Alegandron )...its our word.....>< (i'm joshin you guys:p):D( i'm havin' too much fun:))
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  9. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    Naw, @Victor_Clark , :) I was actually thinking that if you look at Humans from 30,000 ft, and with the devolvement of the Roman Empire in Western Europe, that many other Human Civilizations were growing and flourishing. I was not concerned about what it was called, rather that Humanity was growing and progressing at a greater scale elsewhere.
  10. Only a Poor Old Man

    Only a Poor Old Man Well-Known Member

    I agree with most of what you said. Only slight objection is that I wouldn't call Byzantine art as 'lower quality'. As you pointed out it was just not based around realism. In regards to how the Byzantines kick-started renaissance, I made an attempt to describe it in a recent thread of mine:
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  11. dltsrq

    dltsrq Grumpy Old Man

    It's interesting to note that the first use of the term "Byzantine" to describe the later Roman Empire was by the German historian Hieronymus Wolf in 1557, more than 100 years after the fall of Constantinople.
  12. The Trachy Enjoyer

    The Trachy Enjoyer Well-Known Member

    Indeed. The whole idea was to discredit Byzantium to favor western Europe and the Papacy
  13. The Trachy Enjoyer

    The Trachy Enjoyer Well-Known Member

    Fair enough
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