How many Full Steps do you see? (Part 2)

2,3,5,8,9

 

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2,3,5,6,7,9 all FS.

 

So, I'm not not as familiar with NGC as I am with PCGS. So, based on your description of their standards @Lehigh96, this is what I think:

1. No 5-4-4-5
2. Yes 6-5-5-6
3. Yes 6-6-5-6
4. No 5-4-5-5 (there is a "ding" in the "4" area...this is a PCGS FS in my opinion)
5. Yes 5-5-5-5
6. No 6-5-4-2 (not even close on the right)
7. No 5-4-4-5
8. Yes 6-5-5-5 (close due to a couple "dings" but I think it qualifies as FS)
9. Yes 6-6-5-6 (this one might even get 6FS...really close)

So I have 2, 3, 5, 8, 9 as 5FS (so 5 total). Coin #4 is REALLY close but I think there are a couple marks that prevent NGC from giving it the 5FS grade. I think this is a lock PCGS FS coin (I don't know the Rev of 38 stuff...so if this has that reverse then I would say it gets 5FS based on your statement). Coin #1 is also really close but I don't think it quite gets there.

Coin #9 is almost a 6FS...just barely not there. NGC MIGHT give it a 6FS, but I think it just barely misses.

I think Coin #6 is the only one on the list that isn't close.

 

First time around, I said only two would make a FS designation, but re-examining them, I now say three; 2,3,9. Give us the reveal please.

 

hey @Lehigh96 to me i only see 1 coin, the #9 coin has 5FS. if there's more or less i will copy the picture(s) to my coin ref file and study it. i love the hobby. something new around every corner. great exercise by the way. good luck to ya

 

While there are a lot of responses in the poll on this thread, we seem to have lost a lot of people who participated in the first thread, specifically those who thought that NONE of the PCGS coins deserved FS.

I would like to give some of those people to participate in this thread before the reveal so I have moved the reveal to tomorrow.

Calling the following people:

@wxcoin @Inspector43 @Danomite @Mac McDonald

 

I still don't see 5 full steps on any of them. Perhaps at the end of this exercise you could give your assessment and a description of what qualifies as full steps.
None at the moment.

 

I wrote this over a decade ago. The photos aren't nearly as good as my current photos and I didn't even make sure they were rotated properly, but the information in the thread is a good start. I will probably be doing a more in depth thread about the TPG standards for full steps in the near future.

The FS (Full Step) Designation for Jefferson Nickels Defined (PHOTOGRAPHICALLY)

I will say this, if you are looking at these 9 NGC coins, and you don't see a single 5 full step coin, then you aren't using the TPG standards for what constitutes 5 full steps. My guess is that you are using a standard that requires 6 full steps, but even then, one of the coins listed in this thread is designated as 6FS. Can you guess which one?

 

I gave 9 a FS designation. Several others were close. #2 had a mark on the 5th step, otherwise it would have 5 FS.

 

Using the given criteria, I’d say 5FS on 2,3,4,5 and possibly 6FS on 9. Just a guess.

 

Reveal: All NINE are 5FS or better

Coin #1: 1938 MS66 5FS (Crossed from PCGS MS66FS). People struggle with the reverse of 38 coins because their design has bridges built in. The reverse of 38 is allowed to have both bridges and interrupting marks as long as the overall step detail is good and the fifth step is complete. Almost always, there is weakness under the 3rd pillar in the fifth step.




Coin #2: 1941-D MS67* 5FS. This coin is a monster but the overall sharpness of the steps is not very good. Luckily, though weak, there are no disqualifying bridges or marks.




Coin #3: 1942-P MS67 FS. The FS designation means the coin was graded prior to 2003 and the inception of the 5FS designation. That means when they graded this coin that they thought the coin had 6FS, but I think we can all see the break in the 6th step and realize this should really be a 5FS coin.




Coin #4: 1943-S MS67 5FS. This one had the smallest and worst photograph. Under a loupe, the steps are full and it doesn't surprise me that it got 5FS.




Coin #5: 1947-D MS66 5FS. Much like coin #2, the steps are not razor sharp and the toning makes it look like there are bridges where there are none. That said, there are no major distractions and this coin finished where I thought it would, behind 2,3, & 9 which were the easy ones.




Coin #6: 1950 MS66 5FS. I couldn't even bring myself to vote for this one and I knew the grade. There is a bridge in the final quadrant. You can make it disappear if you angle the coin correctly under a lamp, but I think this coin is EXTREMELY fortunate to have gotten a 5FS designation from NGC.




Coin #7: 1952-D MS65 5FS. I crossed this from a PCGS MS65FS and am a little surprised by the lack of love that it got. There is a little weakness of 4th step in the center, but nothing that I think should disqualify it from 5FS.




Coin #8: 1957-D MS66 5FS. This has what I call PCGS FS. There are a few very minor and shallow marks that PCGS likes to ignore and NGC usually won't. This time they did. Another coin that was very fortunate to grade 5FS.




Coin #9: 1958-D MS66 5FS. If you looked at this coin and thought "NO" then you need to go to Lens Crafters, because you are either applying the standard for 6FS or are blind. There are no bridges or marks and steps really don't come much better than this.





If after the first round of PCGS coins you were perfect because you said none of them had full steps, but then struck out on this round because you also said none of these had full steps, it is almost assured that you are not applying the standards that are being utilized by the TPGs. Now, there is nothing wrong with that, you can apply whatever standard you want to grading, but I'm afraid it is going to severely handicap you in some of my GTG threads.

This exercise start as a bitch session about the results of the my latest submission, and turned into a rather fun game with several teachable moments. Hope you guys had fun, and if you have any questions about the individual coins or the TPG standards, don't hesitate to ask.

 

Two of us guessed all nine were FS...I guess we're just good guessers.

 

Great post. I’m absolutely terrible at grading. My local coin dealer always asks my opinion on coins he’s thinking about submitting. He told me, the last time I saw him, that I was at least 1 grade low but usually 2 grades. He told me I’m too picky. I know he’s right, he has the slabs to prove it. These are fantastic coins!!!!

 

I'm pretty sure you were the only one, good job!

 

It's funny, you might think you are terrible at grading, but you were the only one of the people who guessed that none of the PCGS coins were FS to adjust to the NGC coins. You went 9 for 9, then 5 for 9. My guess is that 14 of 18 ranks you first of all the people that participated. Hell, I only got 8 right.

 

#3 and #9 . On weekends it depends on how much I drink .

 

Thanks...I learned most everything I know from these threads!

 

I hit the PCGS one but failed terribly on NGC. That's the problem with high resolution photos. If I don't zoom in all of the examples look FS. If every FS Jefferson needed nick free steps under high resolution then the population of FS examples would be much lower.

 

I voted I don’t know how well I did but I put my voting. Those are nice

 

The only one that really surprises me is #6...but you said that under the right light angle you can see the defined steps. That would be an interesting coin to see in hand as it sounds like the photo is deceptive.

I really thought you were gonna slide in a a "slider" 6FS with #9. LOL.