Hi, I bought this in a "Job lot" I'm STUMPED !! I can't trace this, I know the pictures are not brilliant. Hopefully someone will recognise it. Thank you in anticipation. Helen xx
Looks Medieval French to me. I cannot read the letters. I think the The Fleur-de-lis give it away. I've tagged my husband. @Insider
All my books are at work. Normally, when I get a coin/token/medal I cannot positively ID, I go to "Google" and type in the date (if there) and the letters on one side (obverse or reverse) and look at the "images" that come up. If nothing, I try the words on the other side. I have found that this works 80% of the time; however, the era your coin (or token ?) was made is a diffucult one that I am not specialized in at all. It is more complicated when one cannot read the coin such as Arabic (for U.S. collectors) or worn coins such as yours with indistinct letters. Nevertheless, I'll bet this is a common type, probably French, and hopefully a dealer or collector here will enlighten us all. If not, post it in the foreign Forum at NGC or PCGS. Please let us know what you find out.
As discussed off line, the fleur de lys definitely suggests some link to France, but the cross on the reverse is very Portuguese in style and the castles possibly Spanish? Could be from one of the numerous principalities in the 15th to 17th centuries?
The cross was the fist thing that made me think Spanish; but the shield on the other side swayed me more. The shape of the "tips" of the cross may also be helpful.
Clearer Images ! I was up nearly all night trawling the web. I'm now stumped, confused & tired Good this collecting lark INIT XX
Call Alan Berman at 845-434-6090. He gave me permission to give out the phone number. He should be able to help.
Agree with @PaddyB - the cross of Jerusalem is very reminiscent of Portugal. I cannot find a direct match in my 1700's or 1800's books, although the 60 Reis is close (the shape of the shield is different.) I might think Portugal, Peru, India (Portuguese colonies) or Brazil might be a good start.
Thanks for the endorsement! I too have been exploring further and been through all the Portuguese colonies and associates I can think of back to 1600, still without success. It is the shield that scuppers them all - seems to be two castles over two fleur de lys and I can find no match for that. I also tried Crusader coins, as they often feature similar crosses, but they all seem to be much smaller. Doesn't appear to match the Spanish crosses - they are more decorated and tend to be in a "frilly" surround rather than a straight circle. Closest match to the cross I have seen is on a 1 Moidor coin weight from George III's time on google images (so back to Portugal again) but still no luck with the shiled.
At this point one wonders if it's a jeton or token of some sort? What would be helpful is if the OP could make out a date, some text, something. Diameter, weight, etc. I found some close matches...but nothing that matches exactly. Like you said...it's that baseball home plate of a shield that kills each one.
That's how I've come around to think from my original post. The cross and flowers reverse design is found on Portuguese coins but not (?) that shield.
I found the same shaped shield on this coin: http://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces50291.html not a match besides the shield, but maybe somewhere to look because the shield shape is the same? I also found some similiar coins, which are swiss canton coins from 1500's.
I also found a shield that shape on a 1/2 Batzen coin of Sitten, from 1640's. I'm stumped too, i find a few shields that shape, but not with a cross like that one.
Oh my goodness. You have been working hard. You all deserve a medal. I was going down the line of Philip and Mary. I've been staring at this bloody thing all day through a magnifying glass and a microscope and I believe the date is above the shield, possibility 1537 ???? So..... I'm off to my lovely bed now. I will try a pencil rubbing tomorrow. Thanks again for your efforts xx
Not sure that is the right shield either! Looks to me like the standard Portuguese Shield within a shield with the 4 components in the centre arranged in a diamond, whereas the one we are looking for has them square.
Looking at the second set of photos, the edge text really makes no sense. It is quite common for medieval french jetons to have such pseudo legends. So i think that's just what it is.
Definitely more late medieval looking than Dark Age-ish, like a Saxon coin would be. It did look Portuguese to me, too, based on the cross, but I really don't know. I certainly wouldn't be surprised if it were a jeton of some kind.
