Log in or Sign up
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
US Coins Forum
>
Hard Times humor
>
Reply to Thread
Message:
<p>[QUOTE="cwtokenman, post: 315633, member: 2100"]There are 8 varieties for this style of token, 5 die pairings, 2 planchet size variations, and 1 off metal (silver). Guess which one is the big buck variety - yup, an Unc silver one lists for $7500.</p><p><br /></p><p>BTW, the token pictured in the OP is HT33, not HT32, still an R1 rarity token, but slightly less valuable than an HT32 in the mid grades.</p><p><br /></p><p>A bit of explanation for the wording on the token for those who may not know or have a bit of interest:</p><p><br /></p><p>The "EXECUTIVE EXPERIMENT", which was the most notable achievement of Jackson's administration, was the separation of Bank and State. The success of this experiment is due the creation of the Subtreasury system, which eventually took form in 1846. On September 2, 1837, the Independent Treasury Bill was introduced in Congress and promptly rejected. A modified version was passed in 1840, but was repealed under Tyler. Over time, these policies became established within the government without regard to any political party. Essentially, the experiment was to remove government funds from State Banks (private institutions) and deposit them where United States Government officials would have control. By doing this, the Treasury no longer was dependent upon the Banks for its fiscal dealings.</p><p><br /></p><p>A "FISCAL AGENT" was an agent of the government that dealt with the fiscal dealings of the Treasury: collection, safe-keeping, transfer, and disbursement of public monies. No one else could perform these tasks.</p><p><br /></p><p>The animal depicted on the OP's token is indeed a running jackass, not a unicorn. Although not found on this particular style of token, some of the other styles of Jackson/running jackass tokens display an "LLD" on the body of the jackass. This was poking fun of Jackson's honorary Doctorate of Laws bestowed upon Jackson by Harvard College in 1832. While Andrew Jackson was a noted military hero, he was not an educated man, and was the subject of much ridicule. Some of the HTTs with the "LLD" show Jackson protruding from a money chest with a bag of money in one hand and a sword in the other. This was depicting a (re-ocurring) fear of the day that the liberties of the Union were threatened "by union of the purse and the sword in the same hands" - referenceing Presidential power over both the nation's money and military.</p><p><br /></p><p>Here is a brief timeline of events related to this and other HTTs (the Hard Time Era was from 1832 from 1844):</p><p><br /></p><p>1828 - Andrew Jackson defeats John Quincy Adams' re-election bid.</p><p><br /></p><p>1832 - Jackson receives an honorary Docorate of Law from Harvard College.</p><p><br /></p><p>1832 - Jackson campaigns against Henry Clay by taking a stand against the Second Bank of the United States. He enjoys an overwhelming victory.</p><p><br /></p><p>Upon returning to office, he wishes to deminish the effectiveness of the Bank (which was chartered up through 1836), Jackson removes federal deposits from it and deposits them in state banks. This and his July 1836 Specie Circular were a couple of the primary causes of the nationwide financial panic of 1837 as well as the resultant depression.</p><p><br /></p><p>1835 - The great fire occurs in New York City (mentioned on HT291, 292 & 293). 648 houses were destroyed, and the city lost $18 million, then an enormous amount. The devastation is at least partially due to the city's lack of an adequate water supply.</p><p><br /></p><p>Feb, 1836 - Facing liquidation as an institution in March, 1836 because of the nearing expiration of its federal charter, the Bank of the Unitied States and its 29 branches, obtained a charter from the state of Pennsylvania. After its federal charter expires, it continues to do business as the Bank of the United States of Pennsylvania, although it made little effort to distinguish itself from its old and familiar name. This bank becomes a major factor in events a few years down they road.</p><p><br /></p><p>May, 1836 - Martin Van Buren (Jackson's VP) is nominated for the presidency. He was also opposed to rechartering the Bank of the United States. His biggest problem was the nation's depressed economy, and he pushed for a separate Treasury (apart from the U.S. government) so that any Treasury surpluses would not be passed out to the states. His stand caused him to lose support of many conservative Democrats, as well as the Whig Party. </p><p><br /></p><p>early summer, 1836 - Facing monumental problems due to the wild issue of bank paper money in the West, as well as excessive speculation in public lands, President Jackson decides to put a stop to them. Unfortunately, his measures are so drastic that the country will plunge from inflation into disaster in a matter of weeks after Van Buren's inaugeration.</p><p><br /></p><p>July 11, 1836 - Jackson issued the Specie Circular. This imposed the restriction that nothing but gold or silver coin could be accepted as payment for the sale of public lands after the date of Aug. 15. While hoping to stop the ruinous speculation in public lands and hopefully lessen the effects of the rampant inflation, Jackson's cure was worse than the ailments. The actual result was that much of the gold drained to the West, causing consternation in the East. Hard Times were about to arrive in a crushing fashion. Payments were not being made, and many loans were about to be called. The stage is set.</p><p><br /></p><p>March, 1837 - a financial panic in England touches off devastating occurences in the U.S. Three large New Orleans cotton companies go bankrupt. </p><p><br /></p><p>April, 1837 - Financial panic is quickly spreading. 128 companies in New York City alone had gone under, 100 of which were banks.</p><p><br /></p><p>May, 1837 - A run started on virtully all banks in the nation, resulting in suspension of specie (coin) payments on May 10. Side note - last year in Guatemala I saw first hand the effects of such a bank run. Banks there were paying only 20 cents on the dollar for any funds withdrawn from the bank. ATMs were constantly empty, money was not circulating. Devastating. </p><p><br /></p><p>summer, 1837 - 90 percent of Eastern factories had shut down. Many people starved and froze during the winter of 1837-1838</p><p><br /></p><p>Somewhat out of chronological order, but I felt a continuem of the background info was important to develop a feel for how things were going in the country in those days. Van Buren had won the election, and in his inaugural address, Van Buren stated "I follow in the steps of my illustrious predecessor", referring to Jackson. Political cartoonists of the day wasted no time in depicting Van Buren carefully stepping in the footprints of a jackass, a sentiment that can be found on a fair number of HTTs.</p><p><br /></p><p>1838 - Many banks resumed the specie payments that they had suspended in May, 1837. The banking system appeared to be returning to normal.</p><p><br /></p><p>Oct, 1839 - Hard Times quickly and dramatically returned. The Bank of the U.S. of Pennsylvania, the nation's largest state bank at the time, suspended operations. It had overextended itself trying to help out the Southern cotton banks. The financial crashing became a roar once again. The Southern Banks and most banks in Pennsylvania suspended specie payments again. During this time, more than 100 additional banks failed.</p><p><br /></p><p>1840 - William Henry Harrison soundly defeats Van Buren's re-election bid, largely by saying nothing.</p><p><br /></p><p>Feb, 1841 - The Bank of the U.S. of Pennsylvania itself fails outright, owing other banks $7.5 million. The country is thoroughly shaken by this failure, and Southern banks suspend specie payments for a third time. 91 more banks fail in 1841.</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>The panic of 1837, accompanied by an overwhelming number of worthless fractional notes (shin plasters), resulted in the hoarding of circulating coins, and the appearance of Hard Times tokens somewhat relieved some of that hardship. That so many of these are well worn are a testimony to the usefullness that they served.</p><p><br /></p><p>There are interesting pieces of script associated with the Hard Times Era as well, but they are harder to come by. There were literally hundreds of different parody bank notes issued (such as from the Humbug Glory Bank), with Rulau's catalog showing some interesting examples. I have only seen a few examples, none of which were for sale.</p><p><br /></p><p>Hopefully some readers will find this background information worthwhile, but this is but just some of the highlights. The colorful history and background associated with some of these tokens is why I love to collect them, I just wish I could remember all that I have read about them, lol.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="cwtokenman, post: 315633, member: 2100"]There are 8 varieties for this style of token, 5 die pairings, 2 planchet size variations, and 1 off metal (silver). Guess which one is the big buck variety - yup, an Unc silver one lists for $7500. BTW, the token pictured in the OP is HT33, not HT32, still an R1 rarity token, but slightly less valuable than an HT32 in the mid grades. A bit of explanation for the wording on the token for those who may not know or have a bit of interest: The "EXECUTIVE EXPERIMENT", which was the most notable achievement of Jackson's administration, was the separation of Bank and State. The success of this experiment is due the creation of the Subtreasury system, which eventually took form in 1846. On September 2, 1837, the Independent Treasury Bill was introduced in Congress and promptly rejected. A modified version was passed in 1840, but was repealed under Tyler. Over time, these policies became established within the government without regard to any political party. Essentially, the experiment was to remove government funds from State Banks (private institutions) and deposit them where United States Government officials would have control. By doing this, the Treasury no longer was dependent upon the Banks for its fiscal dealings. A "FISCAL AGENT" was an agent of the government that dealt with the fiscal dealings of the Treasury: collection, safe-keeping, transfer, and disbursement of public monies. No one else could perform these tasks. The animal depicted on the OP's token is indeed a running jackass, not a unicorn. Although not found on this particular style of token, some of the other styles of Jackson/running jackass tokens display an "LLD" on the body of the jackass. This was poking fun of Jackson's honorary Doctorate of Laws bestowed upon Jackson by Harvard College in 1832. While Andrew Jackson was a noted military hero, he was not an educated man, and was the subject of much ridicule. Some of the HTTs with the "LLD" show Jackson protruding from a money chest with a bag of money in one hand and a sword in the other. This was depicting a (re-ocurring) fear of the day that the liberties of the Union were threatened "by union of the purse and the sword in the same hands" - referenceing Presidential power over both the nation's money and military. Here is a brief timeline of events related to this and other HTTs (the Hard Time Era was from 1832 from 1844): 1828 - Andrew Jackson defeats John Quincy Adams' re-election bid. 1832 - Jackson receives an honorary Docorate of Law from Harvard College. 1832 - Jackson campaigns against Henry Clay by taking a stand against the Second Bank of the United States. He enjoys an overwhelming victory. Upon returning to office, he wishes to deminish the effectiveness of the Bank (which was chartered up through 1836), Jackson removes federal deposits from it and deposits them in state banks. This and his July 1836 Specie Circular were a couple of the primary causes of the nationwide financial panic of 1837 as well as the resultant depression. 1835 - The great fire occurs in New York City (mentioned on HT291, 292 & 293). 648 houses were destroyed, and the city lost $18 million, then an enormous amount. The devastation is at least partially due to the city's lack of an adequate water supply. Feb, 1836 - Facing liquidation as an institution in March, 1836 because of the nearing expiration of its federal charter, the Bank of the Unitied States and its 29 branches, obtained a charter from the state of Pennsylvania. After its federal charter expires, it continues to do business as the Bank of the United States of Pennsylvania, although it made little effort to distinguish itself from its old and familiar name. This bank becomes a major factor in events a few years down they road. May, 1836 - Martin Van Buren (Jackson's VP) is nominated for the presidency. He was also opposed to rechartering the Bank of the United States. His biggest problem was the nation's depressed economy, and he pushed for a separate Treasury (apart from the U.S. government) so that any Treasury surpluses would not be passed out to the states. His stand caused him to lose support of many conservative Democrats, as well as the Whig Party. early summer, 1836 - Facing monumental problems due to the wild issue of bank paper money in the West, as well as excessive speculation in public lands, President Jackson decides to put a stop to them. Unfortunately, his measures are so drastic that the country will plunge from inflation into disaster in a matter of weeks after Van Buren's inaugeration. July 11, 1836 - Jackson issued the Specie Circular. This imposed the restriction that nothing but gold or silver coin could be accepted as payment for the sale of public lands after the date of Aug. 15. While hoping to stop the ruinous speculation in public lands and hopefully lessen the effects of the rampant inflation, Jackson's cure was worse than the ailments. The actual result was that much of the gold drained to the West, causing consternation in the East. Hard Times were about to arrive in a crushing fashion. Payments were not being made, and many loans were about to be called. The stage is set. March, 1837 - a financial panic in England touches off devastating occurences in the U.S. Three large New Orleans cotton companies go bankrupt. April, 1837 - Financial panic is quickly spreading. 128 companies in New York City alone had gone under, 100 of which were banks. May, 1837 - A run started on virtully all banks in the nation, resulting in suspension of specie (coin) payments on May 10. Side note - last year in Guatemala I saw first hand the effects of such a bank run. Banks there were paying only 20 cents on the dollar for any funds withdrawn from the bank. ATMs were constantly empty, money was not circulating. Devastating. summer, 1837 - 90 percent of Eastern factories had shut down. Many people starved and froze during the winter of 1837-1838 Somewhat out of chronological order, but I felt a continuem of the background info was important to develop a feel for how things were going in the country in those days. Van Buren had won the election, and in his inaugural address, Van Buren stated "I follow in the steps of my illustrious predecessor", referring to Jackson. Political cartoonists of the day wasted no time in depicting Van Buren carefully stepping in the footprints of a jackass, a sentiment that can be found on a fair number of HTTs. 1838 - Many banks resumed the specie payments that they had suspended in May, 1837. The banking system appeared to be returning to normal. Oct, 1839 - Hard Times quickly and dramatically returned. The Bank of the U.S. of Pennsylvania, the nation's largest state bank at the time, suspended operations. It had overextended itself trying to help out the Southern cotton banks. The financial crashing became a roar once again. The Southern Banks and most banks in Pennsylvania suspended specie payments again. During this time, more than 100 additional banks failed. 1840 - William Henry Harrison soundly defeats Van Buren's re-election bid, largely by saying nothing. Feb, 1841 - The Bank of the U.S. of Pennsylvania itself fails outright, owing other banks $7.5 million. The country is thoroughly shaken by this failure, and Southern banks suspend specie payments for a third time. 91 more banks fail in 1841. The panic of 1837, accompanied by an overwhelming number of worthless fractional notes (shin plasters), resulted in the hoarding of circulating coins, and the appearance of Hard Times tokens somewhat relieved some of that hardship. That so many of these are well worn are a testimony to the usefullness that they served. There are interesting pieces of script associated with the Hard Times Era as well, but they are harder to come by. There were literally hundreds of different parody bank notes issued (such as from the Humbug Glory Bank), with Rulau's catalog showing some interesting examples. I have only seen a few examples, none of which were for sale. Hopefully some readers will find this background information worthwhile, but this is but just some of the highlights. The colorful history and background associated with some of these tokens is why I love to collect them, I just wish I could remember all that I have read about them, lol.[/QUOTE]
Your name or email address:
Do you already have an account?
No, create an account now.
Yes, my password is:
Forgot your password?
Stay logged in
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
US Coins Forum
>
Hard Times humor
>
Home
Home
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Activity
Recent Posts
Forums
Forums
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Posts
Competitions
Competitions
Quick Links
Competition Index
Rules, Terms & Conditions
Gallery
Gallery
Quick Links
Search Media
New Media
Showcase
Showcase
Quick Links
Search Items
Most Active Members
New Items
Directory
Directory
Quick Links
Directory Home
New Listings
Members
Members
Quick Links
Notable Members
Current Visitors
Recent Activity
New Profile Posts
Sponsors
Menu
Search
Search titles only
Posted by Member:
Separate names with a comma.
Newer Than:
Search this thread only
Search this forum only
Display results as threads
Useful Searches
Recent Posts
More...