Guess the grade: GOLD

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by LostDutchman, Aug 7, 2013.

  1. LostDutchman

    LostDutchman Under Staffed & Overly Motivated Supporter

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  3. spock1k

    spock1k King of Hearts

    you know I am always listening :D

    what I am interested in knowing is why are people calling this ms?

    and if the pcgs is also calling it ms then what does it make them?

    is it possible that pcgs has forgotten to grade?
     
  4. Lehigh96

    Lehigh96 Toning Enthusiast

    AU58, MS61, MS62PL

    I have to say, I don't know anything about this series and find gold extremely difficult to grade, but I can't ignore what seems to be field wear on the first coin and I am not sure that PCGS could ignore it either.
     
  5. Morgandude11

    Morgandude11 As long as it's Silver, I'm listening


    Totally unrealistic. It was obvious to all of the rest of us that they had been graded as uncirculated coins, which in my opinion, they are. Doug, face facts--your grading is overwhelmingly low, and punitive. How can people "learn from you" if you're consistently 1-2 grades or more BELOW what coins are actually grading in today's market. Perhaps it was different years ago (I would not agree that standards have changed as much as you say they have) but it is clear that your grades and the TPG standards are not congruent--nothing personal, just a rather obvious observation.
     
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  6. Ripley

    Ripley Senior Member

    AU 58, EF 40, MS 62 o_O
    Nice ones Dutchman
     
  7. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator


    Yeah, it is an obvious observation. But the real issue is that is also very obvious that the TPGs have changed their standards. And anybody who has been around coins for long enough, seen enough coins in hand instead of just pictures of them, and knows how to grade for themselves - is well aware that the TPGs changed their standards. And changed their standards specifically means - loosened their standards.

    And it's not just me that knows that. Many know it, including those who used to work for the TPGs as graders. And they have written several articles about it in recent years that were published in the numismatic magazines. Articles with titles like - Are MS62 & MS63 the new AU grades ?

    Besides that, I made no attempt to estimate what the TPG graded the coins and said so specifically. Instead I attempted to provide accurate grades that correctly describe the real condition of the coins. THAT is what I hope people can learn so that they do not end up paying too much for over-graded coins. There are accurately graded coins out there, lots of them. And as collectors we should all take the time to differentiate them from the over-graded coins and only buy correctly graded coins.

    As for your comment- "what coins are actually grading in today's market" - and my grading being different, 1 to 2 grades below as you say; have you ever heard the saying "buy the coin and not the slab" ?

    Well perhaps you are the one who should face facts. For buying the coin and not the slab is precisely what I am advocating. While it seems that you are advocating the exact opposite of buying the slab and no the coin.

    Nothing personal, just a rather obvious observation ;)


    edit - Oh, and one more thing. I think you need to read again. It was not obvious to all the rest of us that those coins were MS.
     
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  8. Rick Stachowski

    Rick Stachowski Motor City Car Capital

    I'd say their in the xf condition ! I've collected lots of one dollar gold pieces, larger photos would help, thats for sure !!!!
     
    Ripley likes this.
  9. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator


    How large do you need them to be ? Blown up to full size those pics are roughly 4 times the size the of my computer screen.
     
  10. rlm's cents

    rlm's cents Numismatist

    I think you did not enlarge them. Once you click on them, they can get to about 18 inches on my computer. IMO, that is TOO large to grade from
     
  11. Rick Stachowski

    Rick Stachowski Motor City Car Capital

    you can make them this large 1904 nightempler (2).jpg A062 - 20130527_044919 (3).jpg
     
  12. Morgandude11

    Morgandude11 As long as it's Silver, I'm listening

    C'mon, Doug. You have even admitted you're not a coin collector any more. You aren't around coins as much as you used to be, and things have not changed all that much. I've been around them NONSTOP for over 40 years, and while some TPG standards have changed, it isn't as negative or dramatic as you portray it. Once again, two people--two opinions. Before you posted AU, all the posters were saying MS, so they are influenced by you--unfortunately, to grade overly severely.
     
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  13. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

  14. Rick Stachowski

    Rick Stachowski Motor City Car Capital

    You are so right sir, I've sent in coins to be graded, and when they came back, I thought they were graded to low, so I cut them out in resent them in and they came back at a higher grade then the first time !!!
     
  15. Rick Stachowski

    Rick Stachowski Motor City Car Capital

    I tried to enlarge them, and they came back the same size, maybe because the photos were taken with a camera !!!!
     
  16. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    It's possible your system is blocking it. They blow up larger than can be seen on the monitor for the rest of us.
     
    Rick Stachowski likes this.
  17. Rick Stachowski

    Rick Stachowski Motor City Car Capital

    Could be that's for sure, I'm on my wife's mini dell !
     
  18. Rick Stachowski

    Rick Stachowski Motor City Car Capital

    Since were talking about grading, what does everyone think of the programs that the grading companies offer like: first day of issue, first strike, and so on ! I own both kinds of grades, and there's is a big different in grading standards on the program coins, compared to a regular graded coin, why is that ! I think the grading companies are ripping people off with their so called program coins !!!
     
  19. rlm's cents

    rlm's cents Numismatist

    Actually, once I get it into its own window (click on the arrow top left of the blow up), I can get it just about any size I desire from 3" up and I mean to the point where the nose and eye occupy my entire screen.
     
    Rick Stachowski likes this.
  20. Rick Stachowski

    Rick Stachowski Motor City Car Capital

    Thanks rim's cent, I'll try that !!!
     
  21. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    I had two of the three as AU from the images. I'm not great at grading gold but have watched the change in standards for over 40 years. It has changed and few will argue that.

    Almost every thread I have seen on gold, there is a really wide spread of opinions.
    That tells me, I'm not the only one that has a tough time with them.
     
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