Guess the grade---1903 V Nickel

Frank,

I considered that it could be a weak strike! However, if Miss Liberty's chin, ear and lower hair curls, the Wheat tassels and leaves above her' Crown and most of the Stars are strong, then how could it be a weak strike? I believe that the coin may have deserved whatever grade it was given when holdered in the slab. However, impact from too many years of being jostled around, shipped, dropped, packed, unpacked and etc. while in that holder (the old rattly slab), has done it's damage and lowered the grade IMHO.


Frank

 

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NGC MS63. "Shore is purty", as we say in Texas. :smile

 

Have you EVER seen a coin that was damaged by a rattler? I haven't. Respectfully...Mike

p.s. that's an NGC or ANACS slab, not a PCGS rattler, but the question stands.

 

I disagree. IMO, the weakness in the stars and dentils is NOT from polishing. Polishing (or lapping) would not cause that.

The stars are weak because of the difficulty of striking up these hard nickel coins (edited to add: or a misaligned die), and it plagued the entire serise of the liberty nickels, although more common on earlier dates than those of the early 1900s.

I'm not as sure about what caused the weakness in the dentils other than it wasn't polishing/lapping. I'd guess it was either crumbling of the die or just a weak strike.

All IMHO and respectfully submitted...Mike

 

Correct--it isn't a PCGS rattler, and from what the last owner said it has been in this slab for awhile.

Speedy

 

Yep! I have seen lots of them and even owned a few.

Answer to your p.s. - Yes, I have even seen a few of them! The older the holder, the better the chance that it is or will become a rattler! Due to varying conditions in which the holder may have been stored, shipped, carried, inadvertently left, the holder can and will eventually be effected by heat and cold. If the holder expands while in the heat, the coin becomes loose and can suffer impact damage. I grant you that most of the rattlers that you will find out there, are old NNC, NTC and PCI holders. The next time you are at a Coin Show, ask the volume slabbed Coin Dealers if they have had rattlers in the past or even have some now.


Frank

 

Frank, I'm sorry. When you said "rattler" I thought you were referring to PCGS "rattler" slabs, not PCI/NTC/NNC. The reason I said what I said is because I've seen many, many PCGS rattlers over the years and even cracked out a few, and I've yet to see an example that was damaged as a result....Mike

 

Mike,

Then the slabbed coin was not abused! However, the longer a coin stays in a rattler (slab), the better the chance it will suffer some impact damage. Have you ever wondered why that so many coins appear to have been way over-graded by NNC and NTC (oh well, some have!)?! Well, not all were way over-graded but due to impact damage, the coin(s) suffered and what might have been an MS-64 at one time, became an MS-62 or even an MS-60. The main Coin Dealer that I used to purchase from at the local Coin Club's Coin Show, was a volume slab Dealer that dealt mainly in what you would call problem slabs. The coins in the slabs were either damaged somewhat when they were holdered by the TPG or they were over-graded. I would go through hundreds of the slabbed coins almost every Coin Show (which is held the 1st Saturday of every month) looking for Errors and Varieties and found that probably 80% or more of the over-graded coins were in rattlers. I sure wish that he had not retired because I have purchased slabbed coins with unattributed Errors and Varieties for as low as $5 to as much as $22 and resold them for 10 to 20 times what I paid. The first time I met this guy, I picked up a 1909-P Lincoln Cent that was graded by NTC as an MS-66 RD (I think*) for less than $15 but was actually a MS-64 RD and an unattributed DDO #1. I listed the coin on eBay that evening and it sold for around $100 a week later.

* The Coin Dealer gave nice discounts when you purchased in bulk.



Frank

 

Frank,

Perhaps you're right, or perhaps we just look at different coins and define "rattler" differently.

I mean you no disrespect, and clearly you've had some success in purchasing/selling NNC/NTC/PCI slabs, but I simply ingore the overgraded crap in them. Thus I can't really speak to what's in their holders and if any of that overgrading is due to rattling around or just overgrading.

Regardless, I stand by what I said -- I've yet to see a coin in a PCGS rattler have damage from rattling around, and I've purchased probably fifty, broken out a dozen, and seen thousands. That said, I am open to others whose experience is different....I may be opinionated, but I'd like to think I'm not closed-minded.

Do you disagree with this relative to PCGS rattlers?...Mike

 

p.s. Sorry to Speedy for the tangent.

 

No problem! I'm learning from this thread as well!!

Speedy

 

Nice coin speedy!! I like that yellowish golden toning. I am going to go with 64 - this looks clearly like a weak strike to me. If only they were all so easy.

 

Mike,

No, I don't disagree with you about PCGS rattlers! I look at it this way (and I also try to stay open-minded), that folks (Coin Collectors and Dealers) tend to treat slabs from the better TPG's with much more care. I have seen Coin Dealers at Coin Shows open a plastic storage container and literally throw in coins slabbed by NNC, NTC and PCI when they were packing up. However, their' PCGS slabbed coins were handled much differently and packed with more care into smaller, hard boxes with all kinds of padding inside. I grant you that my experience with PCGS slabbed coins that have impact damage, is very limited but I have seen and owned a few. At the last local Coin Show in Knoxville, I tried to purchase a 1909 VDB Cent that was graded MS-66 RD for a lower price by pointing out to the Dealer that the coin was nowhere near a MS-66 but more like a MS-63. However, the Dealer would not come off the price. Now, whether the reason for such a disparity was due to impact damage or not, is uncertain. Well, the same Dealer was selling raw 1907 Indian Head Cents as MS-64 RD's for $105 each but you could tell that they had been dipped in something because they had the color of a newly minted and uncirculated 2007-P Lincoln Cent, if that tells you something!


Frank

P.S. I am also sorry Speedy for getting on and carrying on with this topic!

 

Alrighty!
The coin is graded by PCI an MS63. When I first saw the coin I saw the flatness and didn't put it past AU58 * but after taking a much closer look I was willing to say MS with a weak strike. I think with the eye appeal this one has it is graded right on. I don't plan on crossing it over to NGC unless I just need one more coin to make up when I send in some next time. It is a really nice coin and I'm proud to own it!!

Speedy

 

It's a nice looking coin speedy and I think anyone would be proud to own it. Good luck on the cross-over!!! It has been an interesting thread.

Thanks

Darryl

 

Speedy,

That is all that counts!


Frank

 

Speedy,
Is it in a old PCI holder by chance?

 

thats probaly one of the best v nickels i've seen! :thumb:

 

Zane,
It is in a newer slab...the gold label slabs.

Speedy