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<p>[QUOTE=&quot;Burton Strauss III, post: 2569382, member: 59677&quot;]I don&#039;t know that they are all that valuable. There&#039;s just not a lot of information or collectors out there.</p><p><br /></p><p>Flynn &amp; Zack&#039;s book only listed a handful they were aware of, supposedly there are people working on books, but nothing has been published. ATS I posted a picture of another 1861 (with a shattered die) and was told it&#039;s well known, I received a PM that one individual has five of them in his/her collection in different die states.</p><p><br /></p><p>Contemporary Counterfeits (of any coin) don&#039;t trade as widely or as openly as mint products.</p><p><br /></p><p>Gerry Fortin lists one trime for sale among his contemporary counterfeits:</p><p><a href="http://www.seateddimevarieties.com/FS_Lists/bogo.htm" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.seateddimevarieties.com/FS_Lists/bogo.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.seateddimevarieties.com/FS_Lists/bogo.htm</a></p><p><br /></p><p>The Liberty Seated club tracks them within their series: <a href="http://www.lsccweb.org/Contemporary_Counterfeits.htm" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.lsccweb.org/Contemporary_Counterfeits.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.lsccweb.org/Contemporary_Counterfeits.htm</a></p><p><br /></p><p>The Black Cabinet tracks modern counterfeits, especially fake slabs: <a href="http://www.theblackcabinet.org/counterfeit/" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.theblackcabinet.org/counterfeit/" rel="nofollow">http://www.theblackcabinet.org/counterfeit/</a> (I&#039;m not sure this is still active, last reports are March 2015).</p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>How rare? Hard to tell...</p><p><br /></p><p>At least with the mint product, you have mintage, know a lot were melted in the 1870s (and up through the 1930s) and have estimated survival rates. For example, <a href="http://www.pcgscoinfacts.com/Coin/Detail/3679" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.pcgscoinfacts.com/Coin/Detail/3679" rel="nofollow">http://www.pcgscoinfacts.com/Coin/Detail/3679</a></p><p><br /></p><p>Mintage: 497,000</p><p>Estimated survival (all grades): 7,500 (1.5%)</p><p>Estimated survival (mint state): 1,000</p><p><br /></p><p>Counterfeits weren&#039;t melted by the treasury, but they certainly suffered the same other kinds of problems: lost, damaged, seized &amp; destroyed. With much smaller mintages. If you made a few thousand and only a few percent remain, that makes them fall somewhere nice on the rarity scale:</p><p><br /></p><ul> <li>R-8: This is a unique coin; only 1 exists</li> </ul><p> <ul> <li>R-7 High: A coin that’s excessively rare; 2 to 3 exist</li> </ul><p> <ul> <li>R-7 Low: An extremely rare coin with 4 to 12 remaining known</li> </ul><p> <ul> <li>R-6: A very rare coin with 13 to 30 known specimens</li> </ul><p> <ul> <li>R-5: 31 to 75 coins exist, classifying it as rare</li> </ul><p> <ul> <li>R-4: A very scarce coin with 76 to 200 examples left</li> </ul><p>[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>

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