Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by old49er, Nov 9, 2016.

  1. old49er

    old49er Well-Known Member

    HI all, Here's another nice bronze I picked up recently. Learning a lot with these ancients. Really interesting history. Every coin has its own story to tell. Sounds like Gratian had a short life, making a lot of enemies suppressing the Old Gods, and stealing all the goodies. Being an Emperor sure didn't guarantee a long life... ancientgracianobv.jpg ancientgracianfollisrev.jpg gratianID.jpg
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  3. Magnus Maximus

    Magnus Maximus Dulce et Decorum est....

  4. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum

    Nice detail.
    Gratian 6.jpg
    OBVERSE: DN GRATIA-NVS PF AVG, pearl diademed, draped, cuirassed bust right
    REVERSE: REPARATIO REIPVB, Gratian standing front, head left, holding Victory on globe and raising kneeling female on left. Mintmark SCON
    Struck at Arles 379-83 AD
    5.7 grs. 23 mm
    RIC IX 20a, S

    Gratian 5.jpg
    OBVERSE: D N GRATIANVS P F AVG, pearl-diademed, draped and cuirassed bust right
    REVERSE: GLORIA RO-MANORVM, Gratian standing right, holding labarum inscribed with Chi-rho and holding captive by hair; F left, E over A right, DSISCR in ex.
    Struck at Siscia 367-375AD
    2.1g, 18mm
    RIC 14c
  5. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member Supporter

    I suspect if every collector made a list of the emperors in order of boredom from a coin sense, Gratian would be in most people's top few. Some rulers had interesting lives; some interesting coin types; some issued widely various styles.....and then there was the ones, including Gratian, with thousands of coins and relatively little demand. I'm sure I offend one of you who is about to publish his massive study of the coins of Gratian but how many of us have a want list of coins including Gratian?
  6. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum

    I already have more than I particularly want, but if an interesting type were to come around.......
    Hispanicus likes this.
  7. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE Supporter

    I have a few Au Gratins... they are nice little spuds, but do not excite me too much...


    RI Gratian 367-383 CE AE 17mm Reduced Folles Leading captive XP banner labarum Obv-Rev.jpg
    RI Gratian 367-383 CE AE 17mm Reduced Folles Leading captive XP banner labarum

    RI Gratian 367-383 CE AE 17mm Reduced Folles Concordia Obv-Rev.jpg
    RI Gratian 367-383 CE AE 17mm Reduced Folles Concordia

    RI Gratian 367-383 CE AE 17mm Reduced Folles Emp Stdg w Shield and XP banner labarum Obv-Rev.jpg
    RI Gratian 367-383 CE AE 17mm Reduced Folles Emp Stdg w Shield and XP banner labarum
  8. old49er

    old49er Well-Known Member

    I just collect the coins that catch my eye.
  9. Valentinian

    Valentinian Supporter! Supporter

    Doug is right about most people not caring much about Gratian, but my want list included every AE type for Gratian. Here is a list of his type set:

    One of these days I will get around to illustrating it on that page, rather than just giving links to images. I have illustrated the type set for Valentinian here:

    and will (eventually) do the same for each of the emperors on my site "Guide to Late Roman AE Coin Types, AD 364 - 450":

    This type of Gratian is particularly interesting:

    His are the only types in the Roman series with the title "AVGG AVG." It was struck only for Gratian and only at Arelate (Arles).
    19 mm. 6:00. 1.76 grams.
    RIC IX Arelate 15, AD 367-375.

    AVGG AVG may abbreviate "avgustorum avgustvs" (RIC page 36).

    Gratian was the young son of Valentinian I. Valentinian, realizing that the soldiers in Gaul might prefer to choose their own candidate, made the right of Gratian to succeed clear by noting he would be an Augustus in a line of Augusti. RIC (page 57) thinks this obverse legend was discontinued when Valentinian died (17 Nov., 375). The legend DN GRATIANVS PF AVG replaced it.
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2016
  10. Parthicus

    Parthicus Well-Known Member

    On the first coin in @Bing's post: What is the kneeling female wearing on her head?! It looks like one of those origami hats you can make from an old newspaper.
  11. Victor_Clark

    Victor_Clark hominem unius libri timeo Dealer

    I like Gratian's GLORIA NOVI SAECVLI [glory of the new age] coinage, it offers a some insight into events transpiring in the Empire.

    EDIT- I just saw that Warren posted a similar post

    "Gratian was born 18 April 359 and in August of A.D. 367 his father Valentinian invested him with the purple proclaiming him a co-ruler, albeit quite junior at only 7 years old! The GLORIA NOVI SAECVLI [glory of the new age] type was only issued in bronze at Arelate and presented him to the Gauls “as the boy destined to fulfil the Messianic prophecy of the Sibylline books and to usher in a Golden Age of justice and plenty." (RIC IX) The unusual obverse legend (AVGG AVG) reminded the people of Gratian’s right of succession. Some scholars have interpreted this legend as "Augusti Gener Augustus" which translates roughly as “Emperor, son-in-law of an Emperor.” The author of RIC IX believes that the legend probably translates as ‘Augustorum Augustus.’ Gratian had the right of succession not only because his father was Emperor, but also because he married Constantia, who was the posthumous daughter of Constantius II.

    The obverse legend of AVGG AVG used for Gratian appeared on bronze coins only at Lyons and Arles on the GLORI NOVI SAECVLI, GLORIA ROMANORVM and SECVRITAS REIPVLICAE reverses. The use of this legend, "which seems to authenticate his right to the succession" at these two mints exclusively is explained by Ammianus.

    Despite his pedigreed marriage and father’s help, Gratian was never popular with his subjects. Ammianus wrote that he doubted the loyalty of the Gallic soldiers to the House of Valentinian (xxx,4) and when Valentinian was ill and not expected to live, the soldiers were talking of their own candidate for succession (xxvii, 6). If Ammianus gauged the mood correctly, this coin was especially important propaganda on the part of Valentinian. However, despite the efforts of Valentinian, Gratian never did gain the confidence of his Gallic army and during the revolt of Magnus Maximus, his troops rebelled and he was killed at Lugdunum in 25 August 383."

    A.D. 367-375
    18x19mm 2.2g
    DN GRATIANVS AVGG AVG, pearl-diademed, draped and cuirassed bust right
    GLORIA NO-VI SAECVLI, Emperor standing facing, head left, holding labarum inscribed with a Chi-Rho in right hand and resting left hand on shield
    In ex: TCON
    RIC IX Arles 15, type xiv(c)

    Gratian Arles 15.jpg
  12. stevex6

    stevex6 Random Mayhem

    old49er => congrats on the new OP-Gratian

    I have a similar, but more humble example ...


  13. chrsmat71

    chrsmat71 I LIKE TURTLES! Supporter

    Gratian was on my coin list until this year when i finally picked one up. I wanted a nice AE 2, so here's what I got....


    Gratian, AE2, 379-383 AD

    O: D N GRATIA_NVS P F AVG Pearl-diademed, draped, cuirassed bust right, R: REPARATIO-REIPVB Emperor standing facing, head left, Victory on globe in left hand, right hand raising kneeling female TCON in exergue, Arles mint, 23mm x 25mm, 4.7g RIC IX, 20a
  14. Pellinore

    Pellinore Supporter! Supporter

    I have a Gratian AE 2, a rather battered and colorful coin, but it is dear to me because it is part of the legacy of my father-in-law. He collected mainly Roman and Byzantine coins, not very seriously. But as a village doctor with an interest in local history, patients came to him with archaeological finds. And in a little town not far from his house, there was a rose grower who occasionally found Roman coins on his land: there probably had been a Roman watchtower, it was not far from a large army camp, at the other side of the river.

    This is one of the coins that were found, a Reparatio Reipublicae type like Bing's. 23 mm, 3,72 gr. Sold to my father-in-law in 1974. With the touching card on which he penned the description in his spindly doctor's hand.


    2839 kl.jpg

    Grat c.jpg
  15. Cucumbor

    Cucumbor Dombes collector Supporter

    Quite a nice OP coin.
    I was grown up in a city named Grenoble (1968 winter olympics took place there) which had been named after this emperor's name : Gratianopolis ending up in Grenoble after some changes through time

    Gratianus, Siliqua Treveri mint
    DN GRATIANVS PF AVG, Diademed, draped and cuirassed bust right
    VRBS ROMA, Roma seated left, holding victory and sceptre, TRPS at exergue
    2.13 gr
    Ref : Cohen # 86, Roman coins # 4133

    Gratianus, AE 2 struck in Cyzicus, 5th officina
    D N GRATIA NVS P F AVG, Diademed, helmeted and draped bust of Gratianus right
    GLORIA ROMANORUM, Gratianus standing left on a prow of galley, driven by a victory. Wreath in shield, SMK gamma at exergue
    5.68 gr
    Ref : Cohen #25, RC #4138, LRBC #2548

  16. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana Supporter

    That's a cool bit of trivia I did not know!
    Mikey Zee and Cucumbor like this.
  17. SIliquae

    SIliquae Well-Known Member

  18. Ancient Aussie

    Ancient Aussie Supporter! Supporter

    I only have one Gratian, my youngest coin 367-375 AD. RIC 23c, LRBC 720, 2.1gm. 20160821_114809.jpg 20160821_114738.jpg
  19. Harshad

    Harshad Member

    1515910652977-620264094.jpg 1515910733707-1774288884.jpg previous owner used sandpaper to clean it lol
    panzerman, randygeki, old49er and 3 others like this.
  20. Ancient Aussie

    Ancient Aussie Supporter! Supporter

  21. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Supporter! Supporter

    Everyone has a Gratian, so I'm puzzled how I missed this zombie thread when it first appeared. I'll join the party and claim I arrived "fashionably late."

    Gratian trivia: Although used in the obverse legend of this coin, Gratian was the first emperor to drop pontifex maximus from his titulature, for he perceived it as a relic of the pagan age.

    This one was tough to photograph because of the dark patina.

    Gratian REPARATIO REIPVB Sicia.jpg
    Gratian, AD 379-383
    Roman Æ maiorina (Æ2); 22.6 mm, 5.87 gm, 8:00
    Siscia, AD 378-383
    Obv: D N GRATIA-NVS P F AVG, Diademed, draped and cuirassed bust, right
    Rev: REPARATIO REIPVB, Gratian standing front, head left, raising kneeling female on left, and holding Victory on a globe; in exergue, BSISC•
    Refs: RIC 26a4; LRBC 1519; Cohen 30; RCV 20008.
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