Grading help please

I can see now how the obverse dies can be used together to make a coin if you REALLY wanted to...

but this coin doesn't appear to have been struck with the force that I would expect from a US Mint coin and I think that the strike is the tell-tale sign of this. While I understand what improper die alignment will do, I don't think that it will leave the lack of design and plethora of planchet flaws that the PCGS two headed coin exhibits.

 

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All the same, what sticks in my mind (in addition to Doug's point, which is also valid) is that the coin appears to have a developed rim, implying a proper collar. My current working theory is one obverse die in place as the hammer, and something round but not hard enough jury-rigged as the anvil. That could maybe result in what we see here.

 

I thought PCGS had some integrity.
To certify this coin as legit, and to grade it the ridiculous MS-65,
they lose all credibility to me.
I grade this illegal coin details VF-30.

 

Calling something illegal when you have no idea or proof how it was made or what actually happened is rediculous to me. Just because someone doesn't understand something doesn't mean a tpg now has no credibility and the coin is illegal

I guess you are also saying Mike Byers also has no credibility since he's selling it?

 

well, not to put too fine a point on this but...

if it was made clandestinely (not an approved Mint product) at the Mint, it's illegal.

if it is a counterfeit... it's also illegal.

I'd like to know under what circumstances this coin is legal... anyone?

 

Not ridiculous. It is my belief that this coin was not produced via the day to day operations at the mint. In fact, as shown by another poster the way the dies work, it is impossible to make this coin during production. It would have to be struck with another planchet under it, and then flipped over and struck again, with a planchet under it. Is that more likely to happen, then someone made it clandestinely?
It is my opinion that this is an illegal coin.
And the MS-65 grade is pathetic.

 

Plenty of coins were not approved that came out of then,isn't that have been trading for decades. But prove it that happened, where's the video of someone doing it?

You should email mike then and let him know his coin could be counterfeit because someone randomly said it and that he and pcgs don't know what they're doing

 

Actually, that won't produce a coin like the one in question. It would produce a coin with one side somewhat clear and the other side smashed.

In order for both sides to be the same, they must be struck at the same time.

 

Well, and the other planchet that was underneath ( 1 or 2) would also be a nice error coin. I don't think that is what happened, but how could a 2 headed coin like this be produced during the day to day production of nickels?
Just trying to figure out how it was made.
I believe the most logical way is for someone on the inside to create it with 2 obverse dies.

 

I think that is a great question and one that we, as collectors can learn heaps from. That's kind of why I have pursued this thread and continue to ask questions ven if not related to the original post.

 

I think that it's been well-established that anything minted post 1970 has been aggressively fought for by the government, but yes, it appears to be as they see fit on a case by case basis

 

I believe the 5 1913 nickels are illegal coins and should have been confiscated early on. The fact that they have been bought and sold a number of times in the last 100 years makes it more difficult to confiscate now, (paper trail of ownership). The govt is not going to reimburse someone a million dollars for one of these nickels, which would result in a long court battle, bad press, etc. when they have other priorities. "Let's drop everything and chase down these 5 nickels." That has escaped the dragnet.
If a 1964 Peace dollar were to surface, that is subject to confiscation. So a legit specimen would have to pop up and be sold outside the US to skirt the legalities.

 

The term of Coinflation is now beginning to strike home with me especially after seeing this coin as MS-65 from PCGS.
Now on to my to next bewilderment, does the new Standard will allow us to grade any blank planchet coin as MS-60 if poorly stuck?

 

Hey, whoever helped this someone with a one of a kind. Mint employee or not, Those are really close obv. dies. ad I don't think I could do any better if given the circumstance. I still don't agree and would pass if I found it for sale.