Gordian III and the Cartwheel - Buying What You Didn't Know You Wanted

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Marsyas Mike, Jul 15, 2017.

  1. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    Do you ever go into a coin shop and come away with the unexpected? While shopping in the real (rather than the virtual) world, I sometimes wind up with an odd batch of stuff. Yesterday I got two things from a local dealer that made for a kind of Mutt n' Jeff looking pair.

    UK Cartwheel and Gordo 3 Jul 17 (8).JPG

    UK Cartwheel and Gordo 3 Jul 17 (4).JPG


    UK Cartwheel and Gordo 3 Jul 17 (22).JPG

    Gordian III Denarius. 240 AD. IMP GORDIANVS PIVS FEL AVG, laureate, draped, & cuirassed bust right / PIETAS AVGVSTI, Pietas standing facing, head left, raising both hands. RSC 186; RIC 129 (2.96 grams). It has a dark, pewter tone to it that comes out darker in my lousy photos. I thought the portrait a pretty nice style.

    Great Britain, 1797 Two Pence Cartwheel. Big and a little banged up. 56.11 grams / 1.979222 ounces

    I'm on an ancients binge at the moment, so the Gordian was just what I wanted. But I wasn't really in the market for a Cartwheel, but it is really big and cool and King George III said "buy me!" and etc. I got the both of them for $40, which seemed like a pretty good deal.

    Any other oddball shopping spree stories out there?
     

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  3. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    Mine is not from a coin show but from a jewellers box in an antiques fair but is does relate to your purchase. A box made out of two Cartwheel 2d coins, hollowed out and joined.

    [​IMG]
     
  4. TIF

    TIF Always learning.

    Those cartwheels are pretty darned cool. If I saw one in a local store I'd buy it too (and the Gordie :) )
     
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  5. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    I like them as well.

    [​IMG]
    George III (1760 - 1820 A.D.)
    Æ "Cartwheel" 1 Pence
    O: GEORGIUS III D G REX, Laureate, draped, and armored bust right.
    R: BRITANNIA, Britannia seated left on rocks, holding branch and trident; shield to right; in background, ship under sail right upon waves.
    Soho (Birmingham) mint, 1797.
    36mm
    28.34g
    6h
    KM 618.

    [​IMG]
    George III (1760 - 1820 A.D.)
    Æ "Cartwheel" 2 Pence
    O: GEORGIUS III D G REX, Laureate, draped, and armored bust right.
    R: BRITANNIA, Britannia seated left on rocks, holding branch and trident; shield to right; in background, ship under sail right upon waves.
    Soho (Birmingham) mint, 1797.
    41mm
    54.73g
    6h
    Peck 1077; SCBC 3776; KM 619.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2017
  6. Nerva

    Nerva Well-Known Member

    A cartwheel was top of my list when I started collecting again. I'd owned a penny as a kid. But I also went to school near the factory where they were made, and a coin collecting teacher took us there on a school trip. They're great coins, made with a steam press. Britain hadn't issued many low-denominations for a long time until the Cartwheels. Tokens were widely used instead. The cartwheels were unpopular because so big and heavy, and were later replaced with slightly smaller coins.
     
  7. Jwt708

    Jwt708 Well-Known Member

    I would have picked up the two pence as well... I was tempted by one by a coin dealer who came to my last base. I think he was a bit optimistic in his pricing so I didn't pick it up.

    Both for $40 is a good price.
     
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  8. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    These things were struck in soft copper so many are beat up especially on the edges as is my 2d. IMO, $40 was fair for the cartwheel alone in its condition. The face has some marks but many are much worse.
    v00700bb2508.jpg v00700bb2509.jpg
     
  9. gregarious

    gregarious E Pluribus Unum

    ..you were "cart" wheeling and dealing there Mike $40..no holler.
     
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  10. Cucumbor

    Cucumbor Well-Known Member

    Here's my cartwheel penny.

    Sp3777-1797b.jpg


    I attempted to buy a 2 pence cartwheel a few days ago aswell which was worn down but unbelievably cheap. Unfortunately it turned out to be another penny, mistakenly described. the seller has been kind enough to refund while asking me to keep it anyway

    Q
     
  11. randygeki

    randygeki Coin Collector

    Great additions! It's nice to be able to head to a local shop and find ancients. Though I tend to not be so picky when I do vs online shopping
     
    TIF likes this.
  12. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    Easy way to tell the 1D from a 2D

    In 2d coins there are 11 leaves while on 1d coin there are 10 leaves.
    The 1D has a taller skinny bust. The 2D has a very round head.

    Three crests on the bottom waves on the 2D compared to 2 on the 1D.
     
  13. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    Some great looking Cartwheels you all have. Thanks for sharing them. Somewhere around this mess (my house) I have a very nice 2d Cartwheel that was made into what I believe is a wine porringer - or a ladle. Not sure copper is used for wine tasting. Anyway, if I can find the darned thing I'll photograph it.
     
  14. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & Eccentric Moderator

    Gordie and the Cartwheel, for forty bucks? Sounds like a pretty good deal to me!

    I've had several of both of the years. Nice pickups!
     
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  15. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    Thank you lordmarcovan! Other than the wine-pourer (mentioned above), I do have another Cartwheel, one of the first coins I ever bought (about 30 years ago). It is in about the same shape as my new one, but only $9 back then.

    As for Gordian, this is only my second denarius of his.
     
  16. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    Cool idea for a thread, and what a fun way to capture coins. I went weird one day:

    I purchased the first example of pure gold coinage, then purchased the latest version of gold in the same day. It was not intentional... just happened:

    upload_2017-7-16_11-0-9.png
    PERSIA, Achaemenid Empire. temp. Darios I to Xerxes II. Circa 485-420 BC. AV Daric (14mm, 8.30 g). Lydo-Milesian standard. Sardes mint. Persian king or hero, wearing kidaris and kandys, quiver over shoulder, in kneeling-running stance right, holding spear in right hand, bow in left / Incuse punch. Carradice Type IIIb, Group A/B (pl. XIII, 27); Meadows, Administration 321; BMC Arabia pl. XXIV, 26. VF. Well centered and struck. (Approx 1/4 TOZ Gold)

    This is the first actual Gold coin produced for the purposes of commerce. Generally they were used to raise armies and/or major payments between cities, satraps, or kingdoms. Prior "gold" coins were actually electrum, which is a natural blend of Gold and Silver.

    and:

    upload_2017-7-16_11-9-36.png
    USA - American Gold Eagle 1/4 TOZ Gold

    Kinda the 1/4 TOZ Alpha and Omega bookends of Gold in Human History at that moment.

    I actually purchased another 1 TOZ AGE also on the same day...
     
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  17. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    I purchased the first example of pure gold coinage, then purchased the latest version of gold in the same day. It was not intentional... just happened:

    Kinda the 1/4 TOZ Alpha and Omega bookends of Gold in Human History at that moment.

    I actually purchased another 1 TOZ AGE also on the same day...[/QUOTE]

    Oh do I love that purchase - the "Alpha and Omega bookends of Gold" - well put. And well played.
     
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  18. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    Oh do I love that purchase - the "Alpha and Omega bookends of Gold" - well put. And well played.[/QUOTE]
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

    Owning gold coinage was illegal in US when I was growing up... maybe it is why I enjoy amassing a little gold. Looks like Darius I started the trend for everyone! :D
     
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  19. chrsmat71

    chrsmat71 I LIKE TURTLES!

    that's the type of pair I can dig! a big ol' cartwheel is on my list...I had kind of forget it was until now! I like larger coins and pre-1900 stuff...so right up my alley.
     
  20. Cucumbor

    Cucumbor Well-Known Member

    Since @Marsyas Mike posted this I've been restless until finding a decent 2 pence : check !!

    Sp3776-1797b.jpg

    Not my pics, I just pasted them together

    Q
     
  21. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    That is a real beauty! Congrats!
     
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