Fun new arrival: 1803 Draped Bust Half, O-104 Small 3

Lol here we go again

 

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OK, I'm here just to be on record that I have read every post on this thread! (Big deal!)

Btw, I like the coin...it has life...it had a life...during a very exciting era!

 

I hear you. There’s a difference (to me) ethically in listing a coin online as a general and not numerical grade, with adequate photos, a return policy, and letting the buyer decide, compared to writing a long description about how amazing the coin is and using the actual phrase “problem free” when you just cracked it out.

Maybe it’s because I collect raw coins more than slabbed, but looking at raw coins at auction or online leaves it up to me as a buyer what my opinion is of the grade, whereas if it’s in a problem slab I probably won’t even look at it because as a collector I’ll never shake that perception, right or wrong. I do understand and applaud the moral side of what you’re saying though.

Sure, no argument against inconsistency at times. It seems kind of unavoidable in a subjective realm with a zillion variables.

At the end of the day we can use them or not, buy coins slabbed with their sticker of approval or not... I just like coins and I do my homework so I’m fine with how it all balances itself out. Just my personal opinion but I respect all you guys for yours.

 

FYI, if you buy a coin in a slab and crack it out because you like it better that way, I say go for it (but you should send the cert # to the TPG to keep stats proper). It's those who crack them to resell as other than what the TPGs designated it, particularly when details graded.

Let's do a little apples to oranges and say you're going to buy a car. The dealer disagrees with the carfax report and shreds it and tells you to decide for yourself if the car is in good shape. It's now up to you as the buyer to figure out if the car is as good as it looks. Did the seller just give it a car wash or is that fresh paint? Sure, the odometer can be read, but how's the transmission working? Are the tires balanced? There are a lot of things the average person does not know about cars that they rely on others to feed them that information.

I know it's a bit of a stretch to draw the comparisons, but slabs help buyers who know less learn about others' opinions of the coin, beyond that of a dealer who wants to make money. Dealers always (in my opinion) overgrade coins they are selling and undergrade coins they are buying. Purposefully cracking a coin out is, in my mind, akin to shredding a carfax report in hopes of getting more money for a car/coin than someone should.

Anyway, I think my point is clear. I won't force it any more, I just am weary of people who say "it's the buyer's responsibility" to know everything about coins. We cannot expect everyone to be an expert and (I believe) we should hold sellers to some moral standards.

Thanks for your thoughts.

 

I’m no expert at grading coins but I think you “accidentally” bought a details coin.
IMHO
I think your lucky it didn’t come back in a body bag.
The observer has 3 mechanical looking gouges and a long scratch across Liberty. Looks like someone tried to fill in the scratch to minimize it. That failed.
The reverse has 4 large scratch marks in the fields near “ite” and a rim ding that looks like the Grand Canyon and from your picture could have been altered as well.
I think it’s a great coin, but a great details coin.

 

F-15

 

I’d say it might be more accurate to compare it to folks who argue about whether or not a paint job on a classic car is original before bidding at auction, but I’m tracking what you’re saying.

Again, so many variables... IMO there’s a stark difference between cracking the OP coin which is well-circulated and over 200 years old but has some questionable areas that a TPG deemed worthy of details and listing it as 1803 Draped Bust Half - VF compared to cracking countless UNC details classic coins and shouting from the hilltops BU FLAWLESS UNCIRCULATED GEM!!! WOW!!! all day every day as a business model.

As someone who casually sells coins from time to time it’s good to know that some folks feel this strongly about it as a rule though.

 

I guess we now know why the lowball bid was successful.

 

It was successful because no one cared about the variety. It was full price for a common variety 1803.

A cleaned-to-hell VG O-104 sold for more than I paid for this coin.

 

I kinda really like her grin...20

 

Uh huh.

Uh huh...

 

There are different levels of egregiousness but at the end of the day it's the same thing.

If you really believe it's wrong then send it back in or to another TPG. If it is actually that borderline maybe one will agree maybe they won't. But taking coins out of a details holder to sell raw is done because of the hope someone will like it a lot and pay up for it thinking it's fine. This is what quite a few regional show dealers do with some of their coins