From A to Z, and Orange to Yellow

As a newbie to Ancient coins that is probably the position for me too. Maybe down the road when I learn more my position might change. Considering the cost of sending it to another dealer, etc, it's just safer, cheaper and easier to purchase elsewhere.

Thanks for bringing this to our attention @Severus Alexander

Things like this can really help a newbie like me.

 

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I'm glad you've found the thread to be helpful, but the thanks belong to
@Bob L.! We really have a great bunch here.

 

Yep it is a great bunch.

 

I admit, I've also bought a couple of coins from Zurqieh in the past, but they were genuine and I couldn't find them any cheaper anywhere else at the time (only one of the two had the suspect patina, the other did not have any sand patina) but besides these I avoid the coins of him and his buddy Athena aka @Salem Alshdaifat for the reasons already stated. As someone else mentioned, Salem/Athena has many great coins that people would buy if it weren't for the same puke-orange patina they suspiciously all have.

 

Dear Severus
I am not asking you to do so with every coin you buy from my store, the coins you suspect I will pay the fees and shipping to other dealer, when you get the coins and found they are as I have stated, then you will be comfortable to buy more, the Patina is Authentic, and I stand by my word, I am a dealer since 2003 , wouldent risk my name for what ever money.
the natural explanation that they come from an area with red soil, this is very common.
I will pay the cost of NGC if the coin or coins worth to spend that money, if the coin you want is less than $50 , I will send it to you free of charge, but I hope not all the members will ask for this treatment loool
what else can I do ?
warm regards.
Salem Alshdaifat
Athena Numismatics

 

or you can mark any coin from this box of 2000 coins I will send it for free , and see if red earthen patina does exist , I cant do more than this.
warm regards.
Salem Alshdaifat
Athena Numismatics

 

Stop selling coins with questionable patina, for starters.

 

for you they might be questionable ?
they are not at all questionable !!!!!!
I was being helpful but it dosent seem that will help !
I am offering a coin free of charge for the member Severus to understand that redearthen patina coins does exist .
you didn't buy from me to know they are Questionable, when you or any members buy a coin and find Questionable then you can mark them that way, I am selling thousands of coins and collectors who are familiar with such patina never returned a coin, you cant mark my coins Questionable based on no experience !!!!
Athena Numismatics

 

You do realize that they don't guarantee authentication, right? (sorry if I interpreted your statement wrong)

 

I

 

I am sure that if you a collector of ancient coins you will know if you are buying from me that it will be authentic coin, we are talking about natural red earthen patina, not about the coin it self.
if I sell a $5 coin and then do NGC , and send it for authentication ! then I surely will lose money, Authentication was never the issue with Athena Numismatics coins, and we have 0 complaint in the past 14 years of authentication, I am an ANA , NGC , VCOIN member and long time dealer, our policy is clear, we never pass to clients a fake coin, and if the coin was so good fake that passed our expertise , then a full refund with any extra fees will be granted right away no question ask, even for any reason you didn't like the coin you buy from us, in 14 days from when you get it you can inform us and send the coin back for a full refund, no matter what is the reason.
we guarantee authenticity for life.
best regards.
Athena Numismatics

 

Unfortunately, for a newbie it isn't worth the risk when long time collectors we trust have so many questions. It's better for us to learn and go from there. To make it clear, I'm not questioning the patina because it's out of my knowledge base.

But, if the people I trust are doubtful I'd be a fool to ignore their advice.

 

This month, makes it a year that I've been collecting and learning from all the members here. I appreciate the fact @Salem Alshdaifat that you have come here to defend yourself, yet I agree:

And it seems this Fake Patina discussion has been going on a long time and nothing changes:




Just out of curiosity I was wondering who you were and I was quite surprised in reading about your Egyptian Antiquities case . Seems ethics may be an issue with you.

I won't be buying anything, ever from you nor from several others on my list including the above mentioned Zurqieh

What's really sad is that I believe you and Zurqieh and that Ilya Zlobin fellow, amongst others, all know and love the coins you sell but have severely harmed your reputations to the point of no return.

 

Thank you for your offer. I will be in touch. My thought is that, as a service to the community, I could acquire 4 coins of my choice from your stock, and send them to several other dealers in turn to ask their opinions. I would then publish their opinions, unedited (& with their permission), in this thread.

Am I correct in understanding that your explanation for the orange patina commonly found in your stock is that all of these coins are acquired from the same source, with a characteristic soil colour?

 

Dear Severus
do you mean by acquire (to buy), or for me to send them to you?
if it is not a sale, you can pick four coins of your choice , I send them to a dealer we agree at, and he will confirm he got them, and will examine them and send back to me.
if it is a sale then that will be fine, you can buy them, send them to the dealer we agree at, and you publish the dealer opinion on this forum and surely you will get an extra $100 as accredit on top of the refund on each coin found with fake patina.
yes I bought them from two sources , I have at least 10 thousands of them.
you can send me an email to arrange this , and I am sure you will change your mind.
I will recommend Barry Murphy, Zach , Pegasi, Harlan Berk , Shanna Berk.
best of regards.
Athena Numismatics

 

Hi Salem - we'll work something out. First I will contact a few dealers to see if they are willing to participate.

 

Any updates on this? Did you manage to work out a deal with Sandman?

 

Not yet - I still don't have enough dealers willing to participate. (Not that I've been chasing them very hard...) If anyone would like to volunteer, shoot me a pm.

 

You are better off getting some of us to buy coins at random from him, or for you to use a vcoins account he can't trace to your person on this forum, and buying coins at random from him.

If he was doing fake patinas, of course he'd make sure the coins he sent you didn't have the fake patina or had the patina removed prior to shipping. This is such an obvious thing that I'm surprised no one said it. Without this being random and anonymous, the test is invalid as it can be easily manipulated.

If I was selling fake paintings and someone called me out on it and asked me to send him one to confirm publicly that my paintings were fake, of course I'd go out of my way to make sure he got a real one. Then go back to selling the fakes now that I "proved" publicly my paintings were real.

PS: not judging the patina on his coins one way or another, just pointing out the flaws of this so called test.

 

A good thought. All his coins are pictured on Vcoins, though, and it will not be his choice which coins are examined. Removal of a fake patina would be immediately uncovered by comparison with the photo. Wouldn't it?