Fake patina?

I concur with TIF on this issue. Old collection coins have likely endured this cleaning and retoning cycle countless times, either through chemical cleanings or burnishing with a soft cloth (many such coins have birnishing marks to prove it). I have some silver coins in my collection that have toned too deeply, and would actually benefit from a light cleaning at this point. The "old collection toning" that many of us covet is likely not more than 50 years old in most cases. Silver coins with good surfaces will tone naturally in 5+ years of tray storage, whether assisted or not; so no reason to worry if the process was assisted.

Bronzes are a different ball of wax, because natural bronze patinas take centuries to form in certain soils.

 

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I was under the impression that silver would continue to tarnish and penetrate deeper into the coin, but after looking around more I am not longer sure. Copper/bronze does not continue. They are reactive metals that create stable patinas over time, which protect the interior metal from further damage.

 

My understanding is that toning (and its various causes) are technically damage to the surface, but as I said on a microscopic level. I do know one collector who is a very good chemist. I can ask for specifics if anyone wants. Might be a dull technical explanation though!

 

That is why I rarely bid on coins from this seller. Coins with scratches, dents often marked as MS coins, artificially saturated images...

 

Spot on!

 

@Nerva @Ken Dorney
Howdy everyone.

Sorry for my previous blank messages. I'm having a hard time navigating here.

Accidentally I saw this post and because I am the previous owner of this particular coin and I am sharing my experience.


I bought this coin from Naville with 2 other coins
For this coin I paid :
130 British pounds
+ 22.45 pounds(16.50 % buyer's fee)
+ 15 pounds shipping (Flat rate for the 3 coins)
+ $35 US Customs fee, based in Naville fedex invoice.

Final price I paid for this coin was $250 .

Do the math yourself.

The invoice from Naville stated with a orthographic mistake " From the E.E. Clain-Stefanelli colelction."

I assume it is indeed Stefanelli because 90% of that sale was from her collection.

In my facebook page, I saw a video ad from ancietncoins.market. I got in touch with them from Facebook and I consigned my coin in their store. They told me this coin has the potential for a flip, however they don't guarantee it. They would keep 15 % from the sale that would cover Ebay listing fees in 2 categories, 10 % Ebay and paypal final fees, and shipping $ 2.77( they offer free shipping) and also 2% for their ads on Facebook.

FYI
Naville photos are washed out.
This coin is sharp in hand. The photos of ACM are 98% near to what the coins looks like however the colors appear slightly stronger in their photos.

One more clue.They clearly posted ( Quoted from their listing "Additionally, colors on the coin may appear stronger in pictures from use of flash.")

Everyone is jumping to condemn someone without reading whole description.


Auction Result.
My coin , L. Mussidius Longus sold for $ 280
- 15 % in fees ( $45)
Final sale is $135

They send me $240 + $10 later that day.
From their invoice breakdown I saw they spend $67

I appreciate I got my money back although they lost money.

This is my experience for this coin only, I don't know about others, that are discussed here.

I seen many bad reviews about ACM. I think they deserve their side of the story.
I will message them from Facebook about this topic.

@Ken Dorney
I assume as a coin dealer you would knew already how much it cost to buy coins overseas and what the fees are.
I find interesting! after you slam someone for "getting high prices" you posted your coin's store link ?

 

Read my previous post .
still new at this and I'm having hard time using it.

 

Edited: I do not agree with their statements on rarity value or condition on coins. That's all I will say.

 

I don't answer for them, I answer for my coin only. My coin sold for cheap not for "high price" as someone claimed. The photos are correct.
In my opinion L. Mussidius Longus is a rare coin especially in gold iridescent tone.
In Heritage auctions similar coin might had scored double and honestly I regret it why I didn't consigned there.
For the rest, you can ask them in their facebook page.

 

You are right, I do know the costs. But you are wrong, I didnt 'slam' him for high prices, I complimented him on it. I plainly said I was a capitalist.

 

Statement !


There has been some "libel" and some “accusations” towards ACM name.

We hope this statement will answer many questions who we are and what we do.


After this topic started, some individuals started false reports towards our pinterest account. These individuals submitted false reports against our coins at:

https://www.pinterest.com/about/copyright/dmca-pin/

All our pins are exclusively our sold coins.

We are not pointing fingers to anyone from this group but is is a coincidence that these attacks started on July 13 after this post and were intensified during last days. Pinterest works based on reports; if many reports come in they would restrict or ban the account. During last 3 weeks, we passed countless hours providing pinterest with paper trail, to prove those pins are ours.

Just yesterday our pinterest account was put under temporary ban. Our team is still working to fill over 20 Subject: counter-notice to copyright.

Pinterest doesn’t involve itself between parties. It is considered a civil matter between individuals. After each counter-notice to copyright, pinterest gave us the information of the person why did the claim.

From all those claims (mostly from fake recently accounts) we identified 2 individuals. One individual is in Canada and another one is in US.

We are in the process of filing 2 lawsuits for defame and libel with malicious intent to harm our reputation. We will seek punitive and reparative damages also all legal costs.

Here it is a case study.

http://www.ebay.com/gds/Giving-Feedback-How-To-Keep-From-Getting-Sued-/10000000001660570/g.html



Who we are.


We are a group of numismatics. Many months ago we took over old ancientcoins.market

Part of the team, are members with experience in Facebook, Google ads, video advertising etc.

We maintain a strong online audience with 3433 active followers on Facebook.

edited


Where do the coins come from?

edited


How good we are doing?

Our latest video ad become viral. It reached 18.861 people and was viewed 11.000 times.


edited

Provenance.

We go to great extend to find the provenance of each coin. If the seller doesn't have any, we post EX- US COLLECTION. Some sellers insist to have their personalized provenance which is either their name, last name or a word of their choice.

A member here accused us of “Fake provenance”

The fact that you don’t see the Provenance from previous sale doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It might have been an oversight from auction house or simply they didn’t post it due to high volume.

This is an example. We pushed the previous auction house to provide us the info about a coin.

Unfortunate this collector’s slip came 3 weeks late after the sale in our store.

All our sales are posted in our pinterest account as open source for everyone. You can easily verify our provenance there.

If we are doing "shady" business why should we post everything???

Let this sink in.

Grading.

In general we restrain ourselves to express opinion on grade unless there are clear evidences about it.

The grading is merely the personal opinion of the grader.

Most auction houses have a policy to undervalue their coins for better PR after sale. For this very reason YOU CANNOT TAKE AT FACE VALUE AUCTION’S HOUSE GRADE.

You don’t hold moral high ground, based on a print screen from previous auction result to judge our grade.

Case study.

This consignment (Coson Gold Stater ) is from CNG sale in 2003


They listed this coin as SUPERB EF, FINE STYLE

To our opinion this is a MS and will be listed as MS

YOU MUST HAVE A COIN IN YOUR HAND, ONLY THEN YOU MIGHT GIVE YOUR PERSONAL OPINION ON GRADE.

@red_spork


Our Listing practices are in complying with eBay rules.

All items are legal to buy/sell under U.S. Statute covering cultural patrimony Code 2600, CHAPTER 14, and are guaranteed to be as described or your money back.

There are many sellers on eBay that overprice their coins and offer “70 % discount ” which is still way overpriced. We don’t see you calling them in. It was in CNG policy some years ago “Employees might use their accounts to raise bids” we don’t see you enraged about it. Heritage auction have some of the highest price realized. We don’t see you questioning about it.


You called us in, this our response.


You never done business with us therefore we do not own you an answer.

If you think our advertising practices are “dishonest” we encourage you to report us on ebay.

It you are still not satisfied, we can solve this in civil court.



Final thought.

We offer authenticity guarantee for eternity. Our return policy is very friendly. We give generous after sale discounts, to our regular customers. This is the reason many feedbacks comes some similar accounts.


If you see big auction houses like CNG, Nauman, Naville Ars Classica, Dr Busso, they remove listings all the time from their auctions and all auction houses at some points sold questionable coins.


We are humans and sometimes mistakes happen.

What makes the difference is the willingness to make things right when problems arise. In this case, we try to fix things as soon as possible in best benefit of our customers. We find it ludicrous to judge the overall performance of ACM with one, two print screen.


What is changing?

Soon we will improve our photos with a 3D camera. The buyers will have the chance to see some amazing details for each coin.

We are working to create an auction platform using edited old domain.

Call to Action:

ACM is hiring numismatics, computer programmers for upcoming projects.

You can work remotely from the comfort of your own home.

For any inquiries or questions please contact us from Facebook.

Best

ACM Team

 

ding ding!!.. i already know who the seller is by this lil number hehe!

 

I think everyone, even businesses, have the right the defend allegations against themselves. However I'm a bit put off on the way you are doing it. When you start off threatening litigation to some of our members, advertise your business fallowing with saying "You never done business with us therefore we do not own you an answer" and ending job openings..... I don't even know how to properly respond to such a post.

I'm not a customer so I know you don't care about what I have to say, and honestly I don't think I ever will be after that post, so I won't offer any constructive criticism.

An interesting PR approach though.

 

The dispute between ACM and one of the members ended in amicable way.

The lawsuits, are against 2 individuals that started submitting false reports in pinterest, with malicious intent to damage our business.
We posted very clear. We are not pointing fingers at anyone.
We don't know if these 2 individuals are members of this group.

Best
ACM Team

 

Like I said, I’m not a customer so you don’t owe me an answer.

 

I am 100% sure that the earlier coins I posted had fake provenance.. you had the same fake provenance for almost everything you were selling few months back whether you bought the coin from Roma Numismatics, Nauman, CNG or whatever auction house, whether it was Roman, Greek, Silver, Electrum etc...

... were claimed to come from the collection of some 15th century German physician....

quote from your previous listings

Grading.

@red_spork
yeah, sure it is subjective.. but i was just wondering... this coin here you sold was graded as "MS⭐️"


Then What would you grade this one from a Gemini Auction? Quintuple Mint State?

I always see people complaining about highratinglowprice here... far more than about you.

I would guess for the advertising.

Also coins are still turning blue once they come into your possession....
before...

currently for sale below...





1 more thing

 

Coin is question is a consignment and definitely was removed as any other auction house would do.

Due to pending allegations We will address this campaign of defame of yours in proper way.
From your hatress I assume you might be one of those "individuals" that attacked our pinterest account with fake reports.
Time will tell.

 

I don't have a pinterest