Fake Apmex 1oz Gold Bar

Counterfeiters depend on the fact that investors, as opposed to collectors, aren't nearly as likely to break open the packaging and therefore can never know whether they have real gold or not. I suppose that could be an issue with any kind of PM product that is sealed and/or slabbed...how could you ever know what you have unless and until you open it and check to verify the authenticity of the contents/item?

 

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Watch everyone in the community begin to feverishly crack open all their bars... CUZ I KNOW I HAVE TOO

 

What ever happened to the old black markets that kept these scammers to a minimum. You had to actually know a scumbag to find this stuff. Now with ebay and the lack of regulation in China, now anyone can be a scam artist.

 

I wouldn't at all be surprised if this puts a real dent in purchasing slabbed products from assorted and/or random parties.

 

Scamming, like identity theft, is one of the top crime areas/zones of the internet age.

 

It's illegal unless it is stamped "COPY". But ebay doesn't care as long as they get their juice.

 

Amen to that.

 

https://youtu.be/ncq9GL6zVK0

Here is a follow up to the fake bar.

 

Here come the Chinese counterfeiters again; apparently they are everywhere.
By the way, thanks for the update. Clearly, the plot thickens.

 

Very good point.

 

Well we had a womens team playing against them, and soccer isn't a major sport in the US.

Since they are selling them in China it is perfectly legal for them (Oh and although they may list them as fake they are usually not marked when they arrive here) But for the person here importing them, it is NOT legal if they are not marked COPY in compliance with the Hobby Protection Act.

Sounds about right for a gold one so it must be plated tungsten.

Just because it was purchased over the counter locally does not mean the counterfeiters are "home grown". They could still be coming from overseas.

Exactly how would ultrasound work? It works for larger bars that have been drilled and filled because the sound waves reflect from the boundaries of the filled areas, but a plated solid tungsten bar would just show as a solid bar just as a gold bar would. The plating would be too thin to show.

 

Yes, the Chinese might be making them, as they are legal to do so there, but the majority of counterfeits do not come into the possession of US citizens directly from the Chinese, there is usually a US citizen selling them at swap meets , on eBay, on Craigslist, in American Pawn and Jewelry stores. They are the ones to blame, so concentrating on how to stop it in one's country by one's fellow citizens is the key. If you see one at a swapmeet, do you call the cops? Probably not.

Lets stay on subject, this thread is not to blame others, but learn how to protect ourselves. Thanks, Jim

 

The velocity of sound in 24k gold is 3200 m/sec and it is 5200m/sec in pure tungsten, so it would be easily detect also by a professional ultrasound fault detector. I do doubt the ones sold in bullion ads and ebay for a fraction of the price as the ones below would be able to do so.

https://www.olympus-ims.com/en/applications/ut-testing-gold-bars/
Jim

 

Seems odd, usually the speed of sound through an object is related to the density of the object. With gold and tungsten having almost the same density I'm surprised the speed of sound through them would be that different.

 

Yes, the results are somewhat unpredictable, Concrete was in one chart and was slightly faster than gold and its density was about 2.0. The rigidity of the material may be a strong factor, but I haven't really researched the reason.

 

Velocity of sound propagation depends more than density. It also depends on binding of molecules (or in the case of pure elements, atoms) to each other. Otherwise soft tissue medical imaging with ultrasound wouldn't work because many tissues have the same density.

Cal

 

Density and modulus.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_sound

Tungsten is a heck of a lot harder and "springier" than gold.

What material has the fastest speed of sound under normal conditions of temperature and pressure? Diamond!

 

Gosh darn it, Batman, here I was still trying to remember whether or not water propagates sound better and faster than air...gee willikers!

 

Crystals are intriguing as to the physical effects between them and vibrations ( from subsonics to light ), but that is off subject so I will stop

 

I felt myself getting left behind some time ago, so I had already semi-tuned out and hit the proverbial brakes.