Featured Extremely early (as in the first) round coin of China.

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by TypeCoin971793, May 25, 2018.

  1. This was a recent purchase of mine, and it arrived today. I bought a Qi knife with it, but it turned out to be a fake (the metal resonated when tapped, the coin felt light in-hand, and the patina had a very chemical-like smell). That certainly puts a damper on the mood, but I can send it back. The round coin, however, felt pretty real in hand, but its bad company has cast a little bit of a shadow on it. It is among the nicest I have seen for the type. Anyone have any thoughts? @Ken Dorney @AnYangMan @Loong Siew

    The reading is “Gong”, which is a city in the state of Liang.

    9C9C2C9E-6351-4962-8213-3141065D9DA2.jpeg E8204F1C-C716-4564-9814-9C0E5714F8EE.jpeg

    A little bit of background on these. While they are China’s first ROUND coins, they came into the picture some 200-300 years after China’s first spade and knife coins. There is some conjecture as to why the round coins came into being, but I believe that they were trying to mimic the form of jade discs that have some important purpose that has since been lost to us. I have read they symbolized eternal life, which would make sense in that they are often found in graves. Given how early Chinese coins were based off of something that had societal importance, this theory also makes sense.

    82323452-0025-45EB-AEBA-7E67E259B0DF.jpeg C14678F0-692B-4701-A51D-781C62616DD1.jpeg

    They were cast in several cities, primarily in the states that also produced spade coins. In fact, there is a documented hoard which consisted of over 3500 Gong spades and almost 1200 Yuan round coins, which shows that they circulated concurrently.

    Here is one with the inscription “Yuan”, which means “walled city”. Looking at the character, you can see what looks to be two walled-in cities on the banks of a river.

    81A2817A-22E5-451C-9C53-475D1C5F747B.jpeg

    A Gong spade.

    D2A443AD-3CF1-4B5E-8CE9-F075FC6B21D1.jpeg

    And here is a lot containing many fragments of some exceptionally rare coins. You can see the variety of cities that cast these coins, which shows that the idea of round coins spread around. But due to their rarity, especially when compared to spade coins, it seems that they were either not as popular, or that they came into being shortly before the Qin state annexed all of China.

    26D8EE20-8017-46F2-9884-183DEC471ABB.jpeg

    In contrast, states producing primarily Knife coins used round coins With square holes. This is a far more practical design because a square hole facilitated the edge-filing process since it could not rotate around a square peg. This design would be adopted by Qin for their Ban Liang coinage.

    Ming Hua. Notice how the character on the right side is the same as the one on the Ming knife below.

    1B0A11B5-5EA3-4314-948E-728305D9F6CA.jpeg A7B7EA29-4F87-4110-8985-A8A1E37A20D4.jpeg

    A Qin state Ban Liang.

    782308F5-11EB-453D-97B9-7DD8F3652B3E.jpeg
     
  2. Avatar

    Guest User Guest



    to hide this ad.
  3. Parthicus

    Parthicus Well-Known Member

    Very cool! I don't have a Gong coin, but I do have one of the Yuan type I bought from Frank Robinson a few years ago:
    Zhou.jpg
     
  4. Deacon Ray

    Deacon Ray JAGWACC Supporter

    Beautiful coin and collection @TypeCoin971793 ! Why are you depressed and asking "Why live"?

    Screen Shot 2018-05-26 at 7.46.55 AM.jpg

     
    Mkman123, RAGNAROK and Johndakerftw like this.
  5. Johndakerftw

    Johndakerftw Mr. Rogers is My Hero

    Life is worth living, bro!

    You have soooooo much to offer!!

    I know what depression is like, it’s horrible. But, I can assure you that the light is still there!

    I really hope that you rediscover happiness soon.

    Your in my thoughts and prayers, Type.

    Erin
     
    RAGNAROK and Deacon Ray like this.
  6. RAGNAROK

    RAGNAROK Naebody chaws me wi impunity

    Cool write-up, as usual. Thanks a lot. And Cheer up, mate!

    Here is one after @lordmarcovan´s "slab-cracking technique":
    yap.jpg
    ;)
     
  7. Ken Dorney

    Ken Dorney Yea, I'm Cool That Way...

    Looks just fine to me. Last time i had one was probably about 15 years ago and it was very similar in fabric, had the same patina, all of which is good and would indicate similar find spots. Mine was authenticated by Roger Doo.
     
  8. What are your thoughts on these? I think they may be very early round coins without inscriptions.

    869CB95B-FDC3-4C7D-A6E1-042C3ABD6284.jpeg A34B5FDC-F213-4E47-892E-5ABFB889E329.jpeg 9140DCB8-FB46-4700-BBCF-CEDEAEEAF94F.jpeg
     
  9. Ken Dorney

    Ken Dorney Yea, I'm Cool That Way...

    I've seen many uninscribed coins but mostly of much later periods. They look right to me and may just be errors, intentionally uninscribed, or perhaps there may be something lurking under the crust.
     
  10. Ken Dorney

    Ken Dorney Yea, I'm Cool That Way...

    I'm wondering about these. They are the plate coins from G&F Volume I, 6.1d and e.
     
  11. Ken Dorney

    Ken Dorney Yea, I'm Cool That Way...

    For anyone without the book I mentioned (probably not many, it was just printed the 26th of last month):

    IMG_3933.jpg IMG_3932.jpg
     
    EllenQ, Alegandron and RAGNAROK like this.
  12. Ken Dorney

    Ken Dorney Yea, I'm Cool That Way...

    Doesnt mean they are fake. Just that they are the exact coins illustrated in the book, and likely the collector/dealer who provided the information to the authors. They are not the same in the sense that they are similarly cast from the same mould, but they are the exact same coins. Same corrosion, same scratches, etc. Hard to tell how many dealer hands they have been through. I believe them to be genuine.
     
    Alegandron likes this.
  13. I meant I am upset to have missed something so rare and important. I 100% believe they are genuine as well
     
    Deacon Ray, Severus Alexander and TIF like this.
  14. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & odd Moderator

    Yeah, that one was a beast to wear on my Holey Coin Vest. Whew!
     
  15. Loong Siew

    Loong Siew Well-Known Member


    Looks fine to me also.. the existence of patches of malachite adds to its authenticity.. it is also a fine piece. congratulations @TypeCoin971793
     
  16. Bert Gedin

    Bert Gedin Active Member

    Any thoughts on Ragnarok's coin ? Yes - MEGA !!!
     
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page