Hi there, I'm new to this forum and this is only my second post. I'm not sure I'm uploading photos correctly so my apologies if so? I'm hoping to gain input on grade for my New Orleans minted 1887/6 over date Morgan Dollar. Any information will be greatly appreciate. I did learn through lots of research that the New Orleans mint produced soft strikes near the obverse hair/ear area and on the eagle feathers and is pretty much accepted as part of this year/mint? Thank you very much
It sure looks like the VAM-3 to me. The condition looks pretty good, too. My only concern is the rim damage at about 3:30 on the obverse. Along with the two dark spots on the rim above the "L" and below the 1st left hand star, I'm wondering if this wasn't in a jewelry mount at one time. This leads me to believe that the apparent lack of luster may be due to improper cleaning. As for value, I can't say. Having collected VAM's for about 20 years, all I can say is that prices can be all over the charts for any one VAM. Chris
Chris, great comments, thank you! I never would've guessed the dark spots could be due to jewelry mounting? I did noticed them but thought maybe it was due to the edges starting to tone? The rim damage looks had to be done by something strong as it opened up/spread the metal. I assumed it must have happened when it was minted? Here are some closeups based on your comments: Thank you, Lori
I never had it in a jewelry mount hotwheelsearl. It came to me this way. Are you saying if it was in a jewelry mount previously this affects the value? I'm new here so learning the effects of certain things on coin value would be appreciated.
@hotwheelsearl is just trying to be a comedian, but with tens of thousands of them out of work, he has gotten lost in the crowd. Chris
Chris, From the additional pics, are you leaning towards it being previously mounted? Just curious if so, does this have a negative effect on the value? Thank you!
Previously mounted coins lose value due to damage. Many times, the third party graders will not grade, or at most, will give a "details" grade - meaning that the coin meets the grade details-wise, but has too much damage (ie scratches, gouges, dents) to be a solid grade. Your coin still has value, but not as much as one without any damage.
Thank you hotwheelsearl, much appreciated explanation behind the type of grading for this type situation
The reason behind my jewelry mount comment is that some people actually pay more for coin jewelry. Since the coin is already damaged, it may be worth it to turn it back into jewelry. Of course, this does depend on how much the coins is devalued from damage. If not by too much, then you can still get a good bit of gold for the coin.
Yes, but that doesn't mean I'm right. If you have a dealer near you, take the coin to him/her and ask for an "in-hand" opinion. Chris
I think I will start off by taking this one into a coin dealer shop in my area and see what they think of the dark spots for sure. If they concur about that these are mounting marks, then I will have to figure out the effect on value. The main reasoning on my determining value on this one, was the conditions it's in considering it's a New Orleans mint and also from my research, the O mint 1887/6 over date held potential for auctioning? If there is a mounting issue, it will probably negate the value of the over date I'm guessing?
Slow down! If it is deemed a problem coin, it won't necessarily negate the value of the over-date, but it will be a determining factor in whether or not you want to pay the additional money to have it graded. These are two different aspects of the coin. There are VAM collectors who may "forgive" the problem just to get that particular VAM for their collection. Chris
Ahh okay, makes sense! I think in my head being so new at all this, I have a fixed notion that unless it's graded/slabbed (one in the same correct?), It won't be desirable to buyer's? It sounds like from your info though, that I could sell it ungraded based on the VAM and mint to collectors in that niche on a forum such as ebay (but probably not at an auction house such as Heritage?). I know these are sort of basic questions, but I figure you have to start somewhere..lol and I swear I really have done an enormous amount of research on my own so far; from my dad's collection, I've managed to do comprehensive research for Lincoln Pennies (wheat and memorial), Morgan Dollars and Jefferson Nickels so far. I've analyzed all the booked coins for these but still have a large box of plastic tubed Pennies dated from 1930's through 1970 for each mint to look through and apply my new found knowledge to (going to take me a long while)! I haven't even gotten to his dimes, quarters and buffalo nickels yet, then there's and I won't even mention his stamp collection (yikes). I have taken in SO much information in the course of a few months in my spare time my brain is constantly reeling from checking and rechecking and then googling some more, buying loupes, scales, etc. etc. I find myself wanting to skip work just to do my research I can see where this could be quite addictive Thank you for listening, Lori
You're welcome, Lori! VAM collectors can be an odd bunch. Quite often, the VAM (variety) takes precedence over the problem. That is why you will occasionally see these collectors referred to as VAMpires. It does sound like you have a lot of work to do, but don't freak out when you start getting into varieties and errors of the other denominations. Like VAM's they can add entirely new dimensions to the hobby we know as numismatics. Chris
I not entirely sure it was used as jewelry piece . The 3 darkened areas are equilateral with the damaged section , but that could be explained by how the coin was sitting in a bag or other location . I'd also expect to see more damage on other areas of the coin where the holder was crimped or tightened onto the coin . Still good eyes Chris but I think this coin would grade straight if that one blemish on the rim didn't detail it .
Hi RZage, thank you for the insight. I'm a newbie so could you explain the term "detail it"? Does this mean that rim damage in general can disqualify a coin from straight grading, such as they grade it then add a note with the rim detail damage? Is there ever any circumstances where the rim was damaged at the mint? The only reason I ask is because the metal is spread to the sides of the ding and it seems like something awfully strong would have to move the metal that way or is it possible post mint for that type of ding? Thank you.
Detail grade , means the coin is somehow damaged whether through harsh cleaning , or some other means where the damage is deemed too bad to give it a straight grade . When done being stamped a coin will fall into a bin of other coins , thus a large coin like a Morgan can receive a rather large ding if it falls rim 1st onto another rim . Though this didn't happen in your case . Looking at the damage I really can't say how it happened . But I'd say there's at least a 50% or greater chance that it would be detailed . I'd like someone else to take a look at the rim and hear his ideas if any how it may have happened and whether he agrees with Chris . @Jim M .
I too think the coin was mounted at some point. I also think based on the pictures that it has seen either a cleaning in the past or spent way to much time in a dip bath. Now for the mark on the rim at 3:30, that is damage. I suspect it is from one of the prongs that held the coin in place. With all that said, Chris has given you sound advice and I agree with his explanations. Would this coin be a candidate for an auction? Perhaps based on the VAM. Will the stuff Chris and I mentioned hold the price down on it? Probably.. It is in the Top 100 list of VAMS, but far from being hard to locate. If you decide to have it graded it will most probably come back as a detail coin, I don't see it as a MS coin. AU detail perhaps.
