Elagabalus Victory denarius

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Andres2, May 31, 2021.

  1. gogili1977

    gogili1977 Well-Known Member

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  3. Tejas

    Tejas Well-Known Member

    Thanks a lot. Yes, that is what I think as well. The celators had no picture of the young Elagabalus, who was still in Emesa, and hence used a portrait that was closer to a clean shaven Macrinus than a 14-year old Elagabal. I also find the depiction of Victory with these long curls rather interesting.

    As a reminder, this is the coin we are referring to:

    Screenshot 2021-06-01 at 10.39.41.png
     
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  4. Tejas

    Tejas Well-Known Member

    Interesting, is there any historical evidence for the use of military scrip in the Roman army? Who would have accepted bronze denari instead of silver?
     
  5. ambr0zie

    ambr0zie Dacian Taraboste

    The best definition i found is here.
    https://www.forumancientcoins.com/numiswiki/view.asp?key=limes denarius

    I bought my limes from a lot because I had no Elagabalus coins. I thought it's an official AE. Well, close enough.
     
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  6. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    Very nice, Andres. I really like the VICTOR ANTONINI type, for the reason that Doug mentions.

    Elagabalus - Ant VICTOR ANTONINI ex Michael Kelly 2994.JPG ELAGABALUS
    AR Antoninianus. 4.21g, 22.8mm. Rome mint, AD 219. RIC 152; RSC 294. O: IMP CAES ANTONINVS AVG, radiate and draped bust right, seen from behind. R: VICTOR ANTONINI AVG, Victory advancing right with palm branch and wreath.
    Ex Michael Kelly Collection
     
  7. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    No Elagabalus Victory reverse types for me, sad to say. Here's an antoninianus, though:

    [​IMG]
    Elagabalus, AD 218-222.
    Roman AR Antoninianus, 5.17 g, 21.3 mm, 11 h.
    Rome, AD 219.
    Obv: IMP ANTONINVS AVG, radiate and draped bust, right.
    Rev: P M TR PII COSII P P, Fortuna enthroned left, holding rudder on globe and cornucopiae; wheel below seat.
    Refs: RIC 18; BMCRE 94; Cohen 148; RCV 7495.
     
  8. Tejas

    Tejas Well-Known Member

    Elagabalus is certainly an interesting figure, with all the stories about his deprived and outrageous behaviour. As is the case so often, it is not clear if all these stories were true or if these were exaggerations to damage his reputation and justify his murder. After all he was only about 18 years old when he was killed.

    In any case, the numismatic evidence seem to confirm that Elagabalus was an extravagant and exotic exception who will like have shocked the Roman elite:

    First, there are his titles as priest (SACERDOS) of the sun god:

    I have the INVICTVS SACERDOS AVG variety:

    Screenshot 2021-06-01 at 15.42.28.png

    and the SVMMUS SACERDOS AVG

    Screenshot 2021-06-01 at 15.43.33.png

    An emperor, who paraded around as priest in exotic eastern dress must have alienated a lot of Romans.

    Second, the first coin shows the famous "horn", which some say is a bull's penis. If true, this would certainly have been cause for outrage.

    Imagine Elagabalus in his priestly garb, possibly even wearing the "horn" at the Mars-field "parade" in 222. Battle hardened soldiers starting to mock him for it. Eventually the situation got out of hand. The sources say Elagabalus sought refuge in a latrine, where the outraged soldiers found him and hacked im to pieces. Than again, his murder was perhaps planned by his grandmother Julia Maesa who sought to replace the unpopular Elagabal with Severus Alexander.

    Judging by the coins above, this is a fairly plausible reconstruction of his face:

    Screenshot 2021-06-01 at 16.10.34.png
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2021
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  9. Cucumbor

    Cucumbor Well-Known Member

    I don't have many coins of his. A denarius and a syrophenician tetradrachm :

    0230-230.jpg
    Elagabalus, Denarius - Rome mint, ca AD 218-219
    IMP CAES M AVR ANTONINVS AVG, laureate and draped bust right
    MARS VICTOR, Mars advancing right
    3.49 gr
    Ref : Cohen # 109v, RCV # 7526, RIC # 123



    0230-410-0251.jpg
    Elagabalus, Tetradrachm - Antioch mint
    AUT K M A ANTWNEINOC CEB, laureate bust right, drapery on left shoulder, seen from front
    DHMARC EX UPATOC TO B =twice consul =219 A.D., eagle standing facing, wings spread, head left, wreath in beak, star beneath, Delta and epsilon in field
    14,11 gr
    Ref : Prieur #251_012, Sear #3096


    Q
     
  10. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    @Tejas Doesn't the read IMP C M AVR SEV ALEXAND AVG? which would make it Severus Alexander.....

    Here is a dated Victory type, just because I haven't seen one in this thread so far. Slightly unusual as it seems to have a star in both left and right fields......

    Obv:- IMP ANTONINVS PIVS AVG, laureate draped bust right
    Rev:- P M TRP IIII COS III P P, Victory flying left holding open wreath, star in both left and right fields!!!
    Minted in Rome.
    Reference:- RIC 45, RSC 195a, BMC 251

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Tejas

    Tejas Well-Known Member

    You are right, I somehow kept it with the Elagabal coins. It is Alexander Severus. Thanks for pointing that out.
     
  12. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

  13. hotwheelsearl

    hotwheelsearl Well-Known Member

    From that definition I take a possibility that they served a similar purpose, if not t military scrip, then to those US wartime Hawaii and North Africa notes - legal tender but distinct enough that they could be demonetized at a moments notice if needed. Something like that maybe
     
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  14. Limes

    Limes Well-Known Member

    Lovely coin @Andres2. Coins of Elagabalus are enjoyable to collect. I have two coins of Elagabalus to add:
    34.1.png

    34.2.png
     
  15. Andres2

    Andres2 Well-Known Member

    Finally came up in this thread , the stone of Emesa. Some day I hope to add one in my collection.Thanks for posting Limes.

    The only other denarius I have:

    P1160707b (2).jpg
     
  16. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    I always wondered if Limes were struck in tough military conflict / border areas that there was a risk of losing precious metal out of the empire...

    LIMES

    [​IMG]
    RI Hadrian, AD 117-138 Æ Limes Denarius 18mm 3.5mm after AD 125 Genius stndg sacrificing altar cornucopia RIC II 173
     
  17. octavius

    octavius Well-Known Member

    Several Antoniniani of this boy-emperor including "happy days" (temporum felicitas), Victoria, Laetitia Publica, and fides exercitus or faithfulness of the army. Seems quite ironic since none of the aforementioned was true!



    3sGKT2jxtM2858oEpG94oi7Dz6W59L.jpg 23202641.jpg Y00520.jpg tk3Xj7DexT2YCfN4oN8ngwE5a6bP9d.jpg
     
  18. happy_collector

    happy_collector Well-Known Member

    My Elagabalus denarius, with Salus in reverse.

    Clipboard01.jpg
     
  19. finny

    finny Well-Known Member

  20. Orielensis

    Orielensis Well-Known Member

    There are a number of splendid Elagabalus coins in this thread. Tejas' examples of unusual and/or transitional early portraits strike me as particularly interesting.

    My own Elagabalus Victory is more pedestrian:
    Rom – Elagabal, denar, Victoria.png
    Elagabalus, Roman Empire, denarius, 218–222 AD, Rome mint. Obv: IMP ANTONINVS PIVS AVG; bust of Elagabalus, draped and laureate, r. Rev: VICTORIA AVG; Victory flying l. between two shields, holding open diadem.19mm, 1.96g. Ref: RIC IV Elagabalus 161.
     
  21. johnmilton

    johnmilton Well-Known Member

    Elagabalus All.jpg

    Denarius of Elagabalus, Obverse: IMP ANTONINVS PIVS AVG “Emperor Antoninus dutiful, patriotic augustus” Reverse: PM TRP II COS II P P “Pontifex Maximus (highest priest of Roman religion TRibunicia Potestate (Tribune of the Roman people) II (second year as Tribune) COS II (Consul chief magistrate of the Roman Government, second time he has held this position, which dates the coin at 219 AD) Pater Patriae (father of his country). Sol standing, right hand raised, holding a whip. RIC 17, RSC 134.

    Here is Elagabalus' mother who was as sex crazed as he was. They died together and their bodies were tossed unceremoniously into the Tiber River.

    Julia Soaemias denar All.jpg

    Denarius of Julia Soaemias, Obverse: IVLIA SOAEMIAS AVG “Julia Soaemias augusta.” Reverse: VENVS CAELESTIS “Venus of heaven.” Venus, goddess of love, holding an apple and scepter. Ric 242, Sear 7721

    Julia Paula was his first wife. She was an aristocratic girl who refused to get involved with him in his perverted lifestyle.

    Julia Paula den All.jpg

    Denarius of Julia Paula, Obverse: IVLIA PAVLA AUG “Julia Paula augusta.” Reverse: CONCORDIA “Concordia” Concordia, personification of harmony and concord seated on a throne holding patera with arm resting on throne, star in left field. Ric 211, Sear 7655

    Aquilia Severa may have been the only woman Elagabalus truly loved, maybe because she was "forbidden fruit." She was a Vestal Virgin who had taken a vow of chastity. Their marriage was a major scandal. His grandmother, Julia Maesa, broke up the marriage, but Elagabalus went back to her.

    Aquilia Severa Denar All.jpg

    Denarius of Julia Aquilia Severa, Obverse: IVLIA AQUILIA SEVERA AVG “Julia Aquilia Severa, augusta.” Reverse: CONCORDIA “Concordia” The personification Concordia standing sacrificing over a lighted altar, holding a double cornucopia. RIC 226, Sear 7679

    And grandma Julia Maesa, who came to the reluctant decision that she had to do in her daughter and grandson for the good of the family business.

    Julia maesa den All.jpg

    Denarius of Julia Maesa, Obverse: IVLIA MAESA AVG “Julia Maesa augusta” Reverse: SAECVLI FELICITAS “Age of good fortune.” Personification Felicitas (happiness and prosperity) sacrificing at an altar. Ric 268, Sear 7757
     
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